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Google hiring 100 engineers for NY office
"not all good programmers live in Silicon Valley"
vitaplease




msg:1237584
 8:55 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

NY-times artilce:

Google hiring 100 software engineers for its Manhattan office [nytimes.com]

Most important snippet:

"For example, employees on both coasts plan to take field trips to see the film "The Matrix: Reloaded" this week."

 

BigDave




msg:1237585
 9:03 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

Now if they would only open an office in someplace nice in the northwest, like the Oregon coast, instead of hellholes like Silicon Valley or Manhattan.

Not all good programmers want to live in big cities.

percentages




msg:1237586
 9:08 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

I have to wonder if these folks live in the real world?

Free M&M's and a ticket for the Matrix is obviously equal to Google share options? One must be worth $100, are the share options only of equal value?

If I was a VC for Google I think I would be demanding this clown's head tomorrow morning, humor has its place, but to this extent isn't going to do them any good with "real" prospective investors!

Appearing to be a bunch of "wacky geeks" for a while can be endearing, keep it up for too long and you just might find the serious investors feel they shouldn't invest in a bunch of "loops", especially when used to attract 20%+ of your payroll.

Nice find Vita!

dougb




msg:1237587
 9:18 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

Could someone kindly tell them that there are some good computer scientists up in Boston, too? This is almost as heartbreaking as the '86 World Series!

Powdork




msg:1237588
 9:27 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

Now if they would only open an office in someplace nice in the northwest, like the Oregon coast, instead of hellholes like Silicon Valley or Manhattan.

I heard they were moving to Seattle.
Excellent for those quick trips across the border for 'creativity seminars' (formerly known as 'safety meetings'). ;)

BigDave




msg:1237589
 9:36 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

To start with, some of the VCs that invested in Google consider themselves to be wacky geeks.

Believe it or not, cheap things that can make you feel appreciated can lead to more job satisfaction than the money. I've never understood why companies would be unwilling to provide free snacks and soda when it only costs around $3 per person/day.

Investors don't care how loopy you get as long as you are making them the money. And the loopy geeks still own the majority of the company and the VCs are happy enough with the way things are going.

steveb




msg:1237590
 9:37 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

"Not all good programmers want to live in big cities."

Mountain View population 72,200.

BigDave




msg:1237591
 9:38 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

I heard they were moving to Seattle.

That's only a sales office so far. And I am trying to move out of Seattle, not further in.

BigDave




msg:1237592
 9:43 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

Mountain View population 72,200.

Mountain View's borders are only on paper. It goes from San Francisco, down to San Jose, up through Fremont, Oakland, Berkeley and Richmond with no real breaks. I grew up down there and even worked in Silicon Valley when there were farms between the cities.

No, they are in the middle of a several million person city/sprawl.

Powdork




msg:1237593
 10:07 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

I've never understood why companies would be unwilling to provide free snacks and soda when it only costs around $3 per person/day.

$3 will go a long way these days. [google.com]

BigDave




msg:1237594
 10:11 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

But they don't get that in NY.

percentages




msg:1237595
 10:34 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

>I've never understood why companies would be unwilling to provide free snacks and soda when it only costs around $3 per person/day.

I have. Reality check......really good people want $300K+ per year or share options of more value. Can you really buy great people for $1,000 of free snacks per year?.....what do you think?

I think I would be delighted to pay $50,000 per year in freebies to attract the best folks....but they unfortunately want much, much, much more......and they are still good value at that price!

A company is only as good as its people...and you should expect to pay them what they deserve and demand. Those that fall for a $1,000 of M&M's and flick tickets are not the folks I want!

Tell me you want a new Ferrari and $250K per year and I will have much more respect for you than the guy/gal that will work for M&M's. Whether you work out is another story!

I'm not a big M&M's consumer, but don't some of the varieties contain peanuts?.....is there an old say saying about that topic?.....only monkeys work for peanuts?

hmmmmm!

BigDave




msg:1237596
 10:50 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

You are missing the point. You still have to pay well. but the freebies give the place a better feel. It helps make you feel appreciated.

Having good food in the cafeteria, whether you have to pay for it or not, makes a difference in the impression that the company gives to their employees.

It is all part of the job satisfaction part of the deal.

I would have serious second thoughts about a hacker that cares more about a ferrari than what he gets to work on. In fact, I can't think of any hackers that would really go for a ferrari, it screams way too much of "look at me, I'm in marketing" for hackers to buy into that.

Powdork




msg:1237597
 11:02 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

Big Dave,
I was trying to think of a way to say what you said.

Jakpot




msg:1237598
 12:29 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

If they would get this dance straightened out they would all feel better.
To heck with perks - today there are a whole lot of folk out of work who wouldn't give a darn if a job offered perks or not.

BigDave




msg:1237599
 12:37 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

Please keep the whining about the update to the update thread. Some of us avoid that thread for a reason.

heck with perks - today there are a whole lot of folk out of work who wouldn't give a darn if a job offered perks or not.

And those people aren't getting the offers for these jobs. They don't want just anyone, they want specific people that are the best, and they get them.

The perks aren't meant to draw them in (though it doesn't hurt). The perks are to help keep them happy.

percentages




msg:1237600
 12:55 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

>You are missing the point. You still have to pay well. but the freebies give the place a better feel. It helps make you feel appreciated.

Which makes you feel more appreciated?...a new car, a new home, or something else you can't easily achieve....or a free supply of M&M's?

My point was simply to make the person feel appreciated with something they really wanted.....not a few chocolate covered peanuts!

If they simply want the cash to spend as they wish.....great...but trying to trick them with cheap frills wouldn't work for me.....and I doubt it would really work for them!

Being part of the "family" is important, but I think being respected for what you can achieve and add to the equation is much more important.

A "nice" working environment is also important, but most people know that it is secondary to their long term future. Creating a nice working environment should be done, but so and more importantly should be "real" long term benefits!

Jakpot




msg:1237601
 3:26 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

"And those people"
Perfect insight is admirable.

le_gber




msg:1237602
 6:09 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

My point was simply to make the person feel appreciated with something they really wanted.....not a few chocolate covered peanuts!

I dont think that they advertise their jobs like

Google is looking for bright and PHD's certified brains to work for their Manatthan office.
Salary: free M&M's supply for as long as you work for us

nor like this
Salary: free car for each employee

This kind of gifts (cars) must be perceived as some kind of bonuses for target achieved or something like that and the M&M's just to makes everybody feel good and part of the Google familly.

If you advertise jobs with the one with free car prospect, you might have some problem:

  • a lot of people who will only come for the car and once they've got it, ditch the company to go work for one where the 'corporate identity' is percieved as good and a better working place
  • if later you want to remove this advantage (receiving a car when you sign your employment contract) it's going to be MUCH harder than if you want to stop the M&M's supply ;)

    Leo

  • msgraph




    msg:1237603
     6:22 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

    >>>Which makes you feel more appreciated?...a new car, a new home, or something else you can't easily achieve....or a free supply of M&M's?

    Being able to use their heads which is what they are doing now. A lot of Google's employees are of scientific backgrounds. Like many other scientists, I believe their main objectives are to reach the sky with whatever ideas and research they have at their fingertips. Google gives them that freedom which I am sure is much more important than a lot of other things.

    I don't know about you, but most scientists and researchers I have seen before, cared more about their work than many other material items.

    Powdork




    msg:1237604
     6:53 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

    If they simply want the cash to spend as they wish.....great...but trying to trick them with cheap frills wouldn't work for me.....and I doubt it would really work for them!

    What makes you think they are trying to trick someone? Not everyone is trying to figure out how to best manipulate their employees.

    A "nice" working environment is also important, but most people know that it is secondary to their long term future.

    Believe it or not, some people consider it to be a primary goal. Maybe I'm different but my 40/week job serves three purposes.
    1. It allows me to ski three days a week even with three young children.
    2. Provides a very comfortable working environment.
    3. Decent amount of cash.

    If times were tough for the company I could handle a cut in pay. If they should touch 1 or 2, I'm gone.

    Brad




    msg:1237605
     9:22 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

    Hrumph! No former Grateful Dead chef? How can they possibly work under these barbaric conditions!

    They should at least hire somebody that once fried a burger for Alice Cooper.

    BigDave




    msg:1237606
     10:01 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

    I'm with you there Powdork. I've quit the best paying job I ever had because the new VP had a very different attitue about the value of the employee's free time. I was even offered a very large incentive to stay, but it would not have been worth it.

    Google's attitude makes it one of the few computer companies that I would be willing to consider working for again. I would rather get a job in a kayak shop that allowed me to have fun than go back and work for the BS employers that think it's all about money.

    Brett_Tabke




    msg:1237607
     4:47 am on May 13, 2003 (gmt 0)

    I'm rather surprised by the location too. But, I suppose after SillyCon valley, any place on the planet would be cheaper.

    Dumpy




    msg:1237608
     12:23 pm on May 13, 2003 (gmt 0)

    I bought a basic home in Palo Alto in 1959 for $15,000 when I become a police officer (They promised to allow me to attend college). After two years of stalling (I moved from badge 55 to badge 5) I quit and went to work for Mt. View Yellow Cab and parcel delivery. I never received a raise for three years, got fired almost every year and rehired...but got a turkey and an envelope full of cash each Christmas. I worked totally unsupervised, saw the owner when I was hired and finally quit (I had graduated from San Jose State). That's when he found out I had been going to college.

    The basic house was sold for $35,000 in 1964 and sold recently for $975,000. I became a stockbroker, moved to an $18,000 house in Walnut Creek, Ca, sold it in 1976 for $65,000. It sold recently for $575,000.

    Two of my sons are mortgage bankers in the greater San Francisco Bay Area, and nationally with online internet applications, (I handle the internet operation) and they say they are appalled by the refinancing fury to raise money for living expenses. Home values are still growing at a double digit rate. If the bubble bursts it will be many years for a recovery.

    I live in Florida in a retirement community where old people come to visit their parents and we have seen a 50% raise in values over the last two years, but housing is still half of California values.

    I just passed through my declining years into my reclining years and am watching my grandchildren trying to figure out how they are going to succeed in life. Their burden seems to be very much higher than mine was at their age.

    Kurupt




    msg:1237609
     9:23 pm on May 13, 2003 (gmt 0)

    Gimmie a break guys. Google makes a small joke and you guys are saying 'dont mess around or serious investors wont look your way' Did you guys forget that Google probably controls 3/4ths of search on the Internet. I could careless about the jokes if im an investor when they have the search engine market pretty much locked up.

    HughMungus




    msg:1237610
     3:22 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

    And overture is supposedly laying off 100...hmmm...

    Blue Gravity




    msg:1237611
     11:18 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

    I want a Ferrari 355 & $350k a year. How's that for your free M&M's.

    jcoronella




    msg:1237612
     1:23 am on May 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

    Aren't there a whole bunch of out-of-work ex-DoubleClick engineers in NYC?

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