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Adwords demanded higher bid - why?
DatabaseMan




msg:1116364
 4:52 am on Jun 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

I checked on a keyword today. I've paid thousands on this campaign in the past. Google says the average CPC has been 0.09 and I've bid 0.15 for some time.

It had a warning that it was disabled unless I chose to bid at least 0.20. Huh?!

Is there a free and easy way to find out what my competitors are bidding?

 

netmeg




msg:1116365
 2:16 pm on Jun 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

No. And even if there were, that wouldn't necessarily determine what you would need to bid, because relevance is supposed to make some difference as well.

ScottG13




msg:1116366
 2:42 pm on Jun 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

Just be thankful Google has not chosen to use their analytics info to determine your profitablity and raised the min CPC to $5.00.

:D

bostonseo




msg:1116367
 3:42 pm on Jun 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

People need to wake up and stop using Google Analytics - why don't you just email them your financials at the end of every month :)

Why do you think Google creates free tools? No company (besides non-profits) give a customer anything for free - Google makes money when you use their tools.

DatabaseMan




msg:1116368
 6:47 pm on Jun 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

What the heck is Google analytics?!

I did recently try measuring conversion using Google's system but the conversion I'm measuring is how many folks are downloading the FREE software. I *wish* a few more people were buying it!

And Google is still showing zeroes for conversion so I'm stumped.

netmeg




msg:1116369
 7:51 pm on Jun 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

If your CTR has been good, and your ad and landing page are really relevant, then (in theory) your CPC should correct itself down to where it was after it runs for a while. Basically you have to kind of prove yourself to Google.

AdWordsAdvisor




msg:1116370
 12:36 am on Jun 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

Just be thankful Google has not chosen to use their analytics info to determine your profitablity and raised the min CPC to $5.00.

People need to wake up and stop using Google Analytics - why don't you just email them your financials at the end of every month :)

This is a theory that seems to have acquired an (inaccurate) ring of truth through repetition - and I'd like to comment in as straightforward a way as possible:

AdWords does not currently (and has no plans to) use any information from Analytics or Google conversion tracking to set minimum CPCs.

AWA

DatabaseMan




msg:1116371
 11:39 am on Jun 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

If your CTR has been good, and your ad and landing page are really relevant, then (in theory) your CPC should correct itself down to where it was after it runs for a while. Basically you have to kind of prove yourself to Google.

I've been paying 0.15 for that keyword for years. I was just amazed that they suddenly required me to pay more.

Then they had a message telling me that I'm missing 93 percent of the available clicks for that keyword. As long as the conversion rate stays at zero, why would I pay more?

I want Google to prove themselves. :)

hatukaze




msg:1116372
 12:24 pm on Jun 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

I want Google to prove themselves. :)

What do you want Google to prove? Do you think it's Google's fault your CTR and conversion rate s*cks?

DatabaseMan




msg:1116373
 1:07 pm on Jun 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

What do you want Google to prove? Do you think it's Google's fault your CTR and conversion rate s*cks?

Touche. :)

Perhaps I should be more clear. My conversion rate is paying the mortgage and all the bills. My click through rate is more than satisfactory.

Google's code is in place but I never see my ads in the search engines so I can't test it for sure. I get "conversions" every single day, averaging around 20.

*Some* of them must be coming from Google AdWords referrals. I want that reflected in the Google stats but they still say zero.

DatabaseMan




msg:1116374
 1:08 pm on Jun 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

I have emailed Google AdWords on this probem. No reply. Yet. It's only been a couple days.

bostonseo




msg:1116375
 1:11 pm on Jun 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

"Then they had a message telling me that I'm missing 93 percent of the available clicks for that keyword."

First of all, for them to state that you missing 93 percent of all the available clicks on a sponsored ad is irresponsible on their part. The latest industry data shows that only 20% of all internet searchers actually click on a sponsored ad - so in the best case scenario a 20% click thru rate is the best you can expect (of course this varies from industry to industry). For Google to imply that AdWords Ads can compete equally with natural results on searches, that is deceptive information.

AdWordsAdvisor




msg:1116376
 1:50 pm on Jun 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

...Then they had a message telling me that I'm missing 93 percent of the available clicks for that keyword.

First of all, for them to state that you missing 93 percent of all the available clicks on a sponsored ad is irresponsible on their part...

My educated guess it that the message was not about available clicks, but rather about available traffic (impressions).

I think that DatabaseMan is referring to a message which alerts advertisers to the fact that their daily budget is lower than that which would be required to allow the ad to show all day.

The message is sent out on the basis of the idea that advertisers are making money with their advertising - and that they'd want to know if they were missing traffic.

BTW, this message is sent out as a result of continued advertiser requests to be given just such an alert - and it is merely a heads-up. There is no action required on the part of the advertiser, and it may be entirely ignored. ;)

AWA

netmeg




msg:1116377
 3:06 pm on Jun 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

The thing is, if Google doesn't think you are converting, then your ad may not be considered relevant under the new tighter requirements, and so you're going to have to pay more to run it, or else improve the quality of the ad and/or the landing page to get some of those conversions.

bostonseo




msg:1116378
 3:12 pm on Jun 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

AdWordsAdvisor,

Databaseman would have to post the actual email (which he cannot due to TOS) to accurately debate
this. I am simply stating that in a best case scenario, when some searches on Google.com and you only have an AdWords Ad - the best case scenario is really a 20% chance of actually receiving a click. I've spoken with numerous Google Account Managers that that conveniently don't acknowledge this.

bostonseo




msg:1116379
 3:14 pm on Jun 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

Netmeg,

"The thing is, if Google doesn't think you are converting, then your ad may not be considered relevant under the new tighter requirements, and so you're going to have to pay more to run it."

How would Google know if you are converting? Your statement implies that Google uses conversion data in their pricing - something AWA flat out denied here.

netmeg




msg:1116380
 3:31 pm on Jun 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

Point taken. Then - I guess it would have to be CTR and/or relevance.

deep_alley




msg:1116381
 1:38 am on Jun 10, 2006 (gmt 0)

Even my assumption regarding the message of losing out on 93% of traffic would relate to low daily budget.

DatabaseMan, are you sure your conversion tracking code has been pasted properly and on the correct page?
I sometimes have noticed the adwords console under reporting conversions. My assumption is that this happens because some people do not wait for the thank you page to load.

Unfortunately I have noticed that a lot of my converting keywords become inactive more often than those that dont convert well. A lot of times I have to forget about those keywords because they stop being cost effective :(

DatabaseMan




msg:1116382
 9:24 pm on Jun 12, 2006 (gmt 0)

DatabaseMan, are you sure your conversion tracking code has been pasted properly and on the correct page?
I sometimes have noticed the adwords console under reporting conversions. My assumption is that this happens because some people do not wait for the thank you page to load.

As best I can tell, the conversion script is installed correctly. Again, I have not been able to test it as I never, ever see my own ads. The money goes out of my account every day though. :) Almost $4,000 over the past couple years.

DatabaseMan




msg:1116383
 12:18 pm on Jun 13, 2006 (gmt 0)

Breaking News! :)

I set AdWords so that my ad would appear only in search results on Google (nobody's AdSense pages or whatever) and I did a search today and actually saw my ad. WooHOO!

I clicked on my ad and went to the conversion page and the Google code worked.

This leads me to believe that my site's conversion rate does indeed s*ck badly, at least from clicks from Google's placement of my ad in places other than on its search engine results.

stakaman




msg:1116384
 5:31 pm on Jun 13, 2006 (gmt 0)

DatabaseMan,

If clicks paid for my mortgage and the bills I would invest in some serious conversion tracking software and website analytics. Does not have to be Google Analytics but if all your work is around this then guessing is not the way forward.

stakaman




msg:1116385
 5:34 pm on Jun 13, 2006 (gmt 0)

Another victim of content match, I wonder when Google finally decide to separate the two. Most agancies are now turning this off to improve the CTR. It does not make any sense for the one to affect the other.

This is also hurting all the AdSense publishers badly.

DatabaseMan




msg:1116386
 2:54 pm on Jun 15, 2006 (gmt 0)

So I found my own ad, clicked on it and went to the conversion page a couple times to see the Google code pop up.

But days later there are still zero conversions listed in AdWords! I don't know what to think.

I signed up for the Google Analytics. I don't even know what it is, but I got a registration code for it yesterday. :)

ScottG13




msg:1116387
 6:56 pm on Jun 16, 2006 (gmt 0)

This is a theory that seems to have acquired an (inaccurate) ring of truth through repetition - and I'd like to comment in as straightforward a way as possible:

AdWords does not currently (and has no plans to) use any information from Analytics or Google conversion tracking to set minimum CPCs.

AWA

The Ring of Truth to this belief came from the close proximity of the release of Google Analytics/Urchin and the appearance of minimum CPCs.

And, of course, the logical profit motive. Charge people more for what they benefit most from. Analytics is simply the best way to figure out that equation. In fact, Google may have a fiduciary duty to do so.

DatabaseMan




msg:1116388
 2:22 am on Jun 17, 2006 (gmt 0)

Ok, so I kept seeing zeroes for conversion rates.

I figured out why! When I log into AdWords, it has a date range set so wide that it spans *years* of time when I did not have conversion tracking installed.

What a moron I was.

I set it to more recent dates - like today - and quickly learned that my conversion rates are freekin' phenomenal! 33% for today for example.

I rewrote my ads a few days ago. My CTR jumped from a running average of 0.11 all the way to 2.85 and my conversion rate tripled.

I'm a very happy camper. :)

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