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Keyword Targeting -Still Rocks, or Waste of time?
Keyword Targeting
layer8

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 2:48 pm on Aug 15, 2004 (gmt 0)


Just thinking about keyword targeting in general...

I used to be a believer in targeting all main keyword terms as they got the most amount of traffic.

Now after doing this a few times and gaining some experience I have seen that the main keywords do not convert as well as other keyword phrases. I only have a few themes to conclude my results from but it seems a waste of time from what I have experienced to target all main keyword phrases.

It would seem better to me to target the themes and not really the main keywords. By themes I mean not really being specific to the exact keywords but changing my approach to building great websites that have a nice amount of pages based on the specific theme and then analyse logs to see serps and tweak as required.

Has anyone got any views on this? I look forward to hearing them and why you have those views.

 

dejaone

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 3:48 pm on Aug 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

I had the same experience. main keywords generate about 30% of search engine traffic. Many users use natural-language like search terms. as search engines get smater and smarter, targeting keywords will play a less important role. Targeting keywords will always generate some traffic, not really a complete waste of time

Richard Overvold

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 1:51 am on Aug 16, 2004 (gmt 0)

If you use Overture as your PPC engine, it looks to me like they have some sort of "standard" on certain keywords. Sometimes, as an example if you enter "the best keyword" and "some of the best keywords" and "keywords with best results" separately they will end up just using 1 keyword that was "best keyword". Unfortunately for me, I don't like that concept, but it's there and there's nothing I can do about it. It almost limits me from finding that keyword that's very popular on the users end, but most competitors have yet to find it. I guess you could say Overture's only using the top of the line keywords so they can line that pocket of theirs to the fullest.

Google on the other hand does not do this as far as I know. Now that I've spoken about it, they have a version of their own done next week, and you'll all be yelling at me. :)

itwebxpert

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 5:25 am on Aug 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

To everybody,

I am very new webie. I have tried to create key words. As my website is not commercial yet, I decided to register it with a few free search engines such as google, yahoo, jayde.com, ODP, etc. After a couple of months my website has not appeared on the Net at all?

Could anyone please advise what I should do?

Thank you in advance.

Itwebx

netmar

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 1:40 pm on Aug 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

itwebxpert, I suggest you add your url in your profile so we can look at it and see if something is wrong with it. However, I have a feeling that the only reason why you can't find your website is cause you are looking for high competitive keywords. Try searching in Google using your url instead. You will at least know if your website is in the database. If so, then I suggest you look at your website stats and see keywords people use to find your website. Then go back in Google and type those keywords to see your rank. Good luck. ;)

itwebxpert

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 2:09 pm on Aug 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

netmar,

Thanks alot for your prompt help. Here is my URL address:

<snip>

it does not appear at present as there are problems with DNS servers at Lycos.co.uk which is my Domain Name registrat.

Therefore, instead you can view this site at:

<snip>
I tried today to search by typing my domain name: itwebxpert in google, it comes up because it has been included in a directory.

I would be very grateful, if you could you please check if there is any thing wrong with Key words in the above link?

It seems to me that designing/developing a website is easier than submitting it into a search engine in order to make it appear on the NET!

Thank you in advance for everybody input.

Cheers

Itwebxpert

[edited by: engine at 4:29 pm (utc) on Aug. 19, 2004]
[edit reason] No urls, thanks. See TOS [webmasterworld.com] [/edit]

HarryM

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 2:17 pm on Aug 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

It looks to me as if Lycos has put up a holding page for your URL. Has your site ever been displayed?

Richard Overvold

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 2:28 pm on Aug 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

You cannot post URL's. That's why he said to put it in your profile. Chances are, it will get deleted.

itwebxpert

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 2:34 pm on Aug 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

Yes, it used to display for a couple of months. It just stopped for about two weeks now.

My question is not about problem with Lycos, but it is about how to submit a website into free search engines in order to appear on the NET.

Thank you again for everyone advice.

Cheers

Itwebxpert

netmar

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 4:38 pm on Aug 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

Well your website shows up at #4 in Google when typing "ItWebXpert" without the url so your website is there somehow but it doesn't seem like the Google spider (googlebot) went through it yet. Since how long have you submitted your website? I noticed activity in Google recently and it seems to me like your site should be indexed soon. Good luck with your keywords!

itwebxpert

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 4:51 pm on Aug 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

netmar,

Thanks lots. You think my website might appear soon because it ranks in the fourth in Google?

Shall I need to modify some of my keywords? I do need helps from you guys who have been webmasters for long.

Thank you again for everybody.

Cheers

Itwebxpert

HarryM

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 5:22 pm on Aug 17, 2004 (gmt 0)

Your problem may well be due to Lycos. Google or any other SE cannot spider your site unless it can get past the holding page. They will also assume you only have a single page site and rank you accordingly.

If were you, my priority would be to get the site displaying properly.

itwebxpert

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 8:30 am on Aug 19, 2004 (gmt 0)

Hi HarryM & Netmar,

My site is now up - displayed properly (URL in my profile). Any suggestion?

Thank you in advance.

Itwebxpert

HarryM

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 10:46 pm on Aug 19, 2004 (gmt 0)

If your site is www.yourname.co.uk then I still see the Lycos holding page. It shows as PR0 in my Google toolbar which means Google has visited. It also shows as just a URL in the Google index.

Actually your site name is not in your profile. I think that's because it's not allowed for New Users.

itwebxpert

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 5:27 am on Aug 20, 2004 (gmt 0)

HarryM,

My site was up for about 1 hour and then disappeared again. Lycos has tried to update their DNS server, but the problem remains. They advised me that they would try again.

What your suggestion would be in order for my site to be displayed - what problem at Lycos?

Cheers
Itwebxpert

HarryM

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 10:56 pm on Aug 20, 2004 (gmt 0)

Itwebxpert,

I have no idea what the problem is with your site. The Lycos holding page is still showing. You are going to have to sort it out with them.

HaryM

ritalia

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 8:44 am on Aug 23, 2004 (gmt 0)

what does submiting your site really mean and how does one accomplish that?

mona

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 2:35 pm on Aug 24, 2004 (gmt 0)

ritalia, here's a link for that, and welcome to WebmasterWorld.
[webmasterworld.com ]

layer8 -
Getting back on topic...:)

Now after doing this a few times and gaining some experience I have seen that the main keywords do not convert as well as other keyword phrases.

I have to agree with that. I'd say about 20% of our sales come from our main KW phrases: red widget. About 30-40% come from KW phrases that use part or all of a main KW plus another specific KW: Joe red widgets. And almost half our sales come from very targeted specific KW phrases:Joe red model 6458.

..it seems a waste of time from what I have experienced to target all main keyword phrases. It would seem better to me to target the themes and not really the main keywords.

But aren't they sort of related? (I'll refer to the Theme Pyramid [webmasterworld.com] thread here) When you're building a themed site, you use the main KW phrase as the theme, or top of the pyramid. Then you build pages to support theme which naturally extend the KW phrase to a longer, more specific phrase.

So I agree that themes are better that just focusing on the main KWs. But to build a good theme, you must target a main KW phrase to get it started.

anallawalla

WebmasterWorld Administrator anallawalla us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 10:31 am on Sep 6, 2004 (gmt 0)

Often, one's "main" keywords are the most competitive ones, whereas the obscure ones that you have discovered but competitors have not seem to be "better". It is a good challenge to optimise for your main keywords - not a waste of time.

We have found that advertising through third party directories does well for some of our "main" keywords.

itwebxpert

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 11:11 am on Sep 6, 2004 (gmt 0)

HarryM,

My website is up now. There was a problem with errors in registrat's database. I am grateful if you could advise me on how to get my website appearing on the Internet. I submitted my website to google and others for months, it don't still appear on the Internet?

It might be because of my selected keywords, or wrong submission, etc.

I hope to hear from you soon.

Cheers
Itwebxpert

HarryM

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 11:40 am on Sep 6, 2004 (gmt 0)

itwebxpert,

Google knows about your home page because it is PR0 and appears in Google SERPS. But none of the other pages show, probably because of the problems you have had.

I suggest you get more links to your site. Hopefully Google will find and follow them, and then will index the rest of your site.

itwebxpert

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 8:50 pm on Sep 6, 2004 (gmt 0)

HarryM

Can you advise on the best way I can get more links to my website?

Do I need to resubmit my website to Google?

Cheers

mona

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 8:50 pm on Sep 7, 2004 (gmt 0)

itwebxpert,
The first place to submit your site is here - DMOZ [dmoz.org] Note: It could take days or months for it to be included. While you're there, look for niche directories to submit your site to.

You can also check out the Link Development [webmasterworld.com] for discussion about acquiring links. I'd recommend reading threads from the library [webmasterworld.com] first - there's some good stuff there. If you want fast results, you may want to pay for a few links. I do it all the time and it's worth it.

itwebxpert

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 8:16 am on Sep 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

mona,

thanks for your reply. I have already submitted my site to www.dmoz.com. I will have a look at the links you provided.

Cheers
ItWebXpert

lazerbud

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 7:50 am on Sep 14, 2004 (gmt 0)

I never understood the concept of adding highly searched keywords on your pages. The more they're searched the more the competition for rankings. I'd rather spend time looking for links in the time it takes to do keyword research.

Ofcourse, this depends of the content of the pages, if my pages are about cery unique materials, chances are you will be well ranked by google for keywords relating to your unique content. On the other hand, boring generic content might need to be perked up with keywords. So all is not lost with Keywords research!

ronburk

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1044 posted 5:35 pm on Sep 16, 2004 (gmt 0)

There is something to be said for an SEO campaign that focuses on a high number of non-primary keywords and little, or not at all, on the most obvious keywords.

If you're in a highly competitive area, you can start getting relevant traffic, even without ranking well (or at all!) for the most obvious keywords.

In a highly competitive area, this strategy can help keep you "under the radar" of the big guns. If you don't rank well (or at all!) for the obvious keywords, then they quite possibly will never notice you quietly making a tidy profit in their niche.

The folks that live and die by being in the top 5 SERPs for the most obvious keywords must live in fear of every little Google algorithm change that could affect a small handful of keywords. By focusing instead on a large number of peripheral keywords, you're much less likely to be greatly affected by any particular Google change.

Ad fatigue may be higher for highly competitive terms, whereas the "related" terms that happen to show an ad for the prime keyword may break through. IOW, instead of pounding the user with "Buy X now!", you attract him with Y content (where Y is logically related to X) and get him to say "Yes, Y, Y, Y... oh, almost forgot I should probably buy an X!"

It's a much calmer and more methodical method of building traffic. Instead of spending time building ever more complicated theories about how Google works, you really have two fairly simple activities: adding to the keyword list (either from thinking, surfing, or pulling search terms out of your logs), and adding content for each keyword in your list that isn't yet ranking.

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