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Espotting Raises Min Bid to 10p

 9:48 am on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

I did not think it would take long for them to follow.

"As of 1:00am on Tuesday 15th April 2003, Espotting will be increasing its minimum bid from 5p to 10p across the UK network. All bids between 5p and 9p will automatically be moved to 10p with their positions retained."




 10:04 am on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

Can you forward a copy of the email onto me please

P.S I've just spoken to espotting, it looks like an email is going out today, not very impressed at all :(


 10:58 am on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

100 per cent increase.
stuff em.


 11:02 am on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

That's what I've just told them I've got over 300 bids at 5p paying £600.00 p/m all will be stopped


 11:12 am on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

Every time Espotting UK or Overture UK introduces changes to their service there is outrage from the members of this site. I include myself in this group.

I see the problem as there are only 2 main PPC players within the UK and it is causing a monopoly were they can dictated how the market is run and how much it will cost.

The solution to this problem would be the introduction of a third major player. I believe the members of this forum can make this happen.

How much is the combined spending the members of this forum spend on PPC? I would suggest this is a huge amount. :)

Put simply:
If the members of this forum committed themselves to a third PPC either existing or waiting to be developed (I am sure that we have the combined skill base to create the ultimate PPC system) that company would then be able to capture the supplier contracts to the main UK search engine, either now or when the contract came up for renewal.

The actual creation and implementation of this proposal requires a hell of a lot of work but it would introduce greater competition into this market.

Or am I am being very naive. ;)


 11:20 am on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

was bound to happen after Overture did it.

Whilst you might expect it to be a 100% increase, that wasn't our experience when overture did it. Frankly, competitive terms are already over 10 pence, which means 5p bids get very low traffic numbers on these terms. Similarly, 5p bids with no competition tend to have low searches, so although these numbers double, the amounts are still relatively small - for Espotting and Overture if not for people bidding on the terms.

Of course I am not jumping for joy, but we generally pass these fees on so not much trauma and not a large increase in our monthly bill.



 11:24 am on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

If the members of this forum committed themselves to a third PPC either existing or waiting to be developed

Mirago is already there - an excellent system. But its destiny is not in our hands - Mirago (or any other) is only as good as its partners. The partners want the ones with the highest bidding, to get the highest revenues... which is the two big players. There is an economy of scale here that creates a massive barrier to entry.



 11:49 am on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

>The solution to this problem would be the introduction of a third major player. I believe the members of this forum can make this happen.

Erm..heard of Google Adwords UK?


 11:52 am on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

I just sent espotting a note telling them how much their policy stinks.

What do we get for a 100% increase - nothing!

I will cancel all but the best performing terms. I hope it costs them lots.


 12:11 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

Account was running dry and I was just about to replenish - but not now (well maybe once I've calmed down). This is much worse than the Overture increase as everything there was well above 10c. However, with Espotting most bids are 5p so 100% increase.

I don't want to spend anymore with them. They could at least have grandfathered .... :(


 12:21 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

100 per cent increase.
stuff em.


The new price is way too high in my opinion. They stand to loose a lot of clients if they go through with this increase.


 12:30 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

As we don't like increasing costs

Yeah right!

This move was inevitable. It has happened the day before the Overture bids are mandated to go to the 10p minimum. Espotting got a bunch of free PR on the back of Overture's decision.

I think for as long as Google are pre IPO they will dine out on this. They can probably give enough revenue away to cover the difference in any JV anomalies and because they get more searches their 4p clicks generally will get more revenue than the 10p's on Overture and espotting.

Mirago have always been at 10p minimum and don't seem to have suffered, but it will force several smaller advertisers to look seriously about the viability of PPC.


 12:46 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

>>They stand to loose a lot of clients if they go through
>>with this increase.

that's fine by me. nothing better than less competition for my clients.

like receptional said, most competitive terms are already over 10p anyway and the 5p bids don't get a lot of traffic - therefore espotting won't lose much if hundreds of 5p bidders quit.

anyone quitting espotting or overture is simply doing more harm to themselves than to overture or espotting.


 12:48 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

>therefore espotting won't lose much if hundreds of 5p bidders quit

True, But all my bids are 5p and I spend £600.00 per mth and I'm not letting them go to 10p


 12:54 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

I agree with tigger, 90% of our bids are £0.05 so it has doubled our spend.


 2:02 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

Kevin, the main problem is getting partners for a new PPC engine. Mirago have been actively seeking out as many new partners as possible, and it is having an effect. As those partners grow in popularity, so will Mirago's influence in the market. However, Mirago was the *first* PPC to go for a 10p minimum.

We will see a new PPC in the UK market next month, with a 1p minimum. However, the problem for them will be getting enough partner sites to justify advertisers spending the time setting up and managing accounts.


 2:04 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

Mirago (or any other) is only as good as its partners.

I agree with your comments but I believe that a visible commitment by marketing and web masters to a third party which said ‘You build your partner base and we will transfer the accounts”. We would get the system we want and this would enable a third party to become an influential future player.

I think we do have the power to change the present situation.

I have heard of Google Adwords. Overture and Espotting feed different engines so I'm not sure how your comment is relevant.

I see the decisions to pull account off Espotting is already happening. The same happened when Overture announced their increase. Apart from Google Adwords where do you go to get the same results for your clients within the PPC market?


 2:19 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

I wonder what influence this will have on Espotting's partners?

Will they see an initial drop in revenue as webmasters leave the scheme? or will it be a slight jump as all the 5p bids get pushed up to 10p?


 3:14 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

What I think is outrageous is that they use their notice of a bid increase to cross-sell their "optimization" service:
So, I could pay them over $100 to have some twenty-something year-old just coming back from the pub add half-relevant terms to my account at $0.16/click.

[edited by: engine at 3:18 pm (utc) on Mar. 28, 2003]
[edit reason] No e-mails, thanks. See [webmasterworld.com] [/edit]


 3:21 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

Yep when the rep was on the phone to me, he told me about that as well I told him most webmaster would prefer to pick there own keywords so that little sweetener won't go down well.

But! He did say they will be announcing some new outlets for there results over the next few months, hence one of the reasons for the increase, I would much sooner it stay the same


 3:22 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

So we'll do exactly what we did at Overture UK -- wholesale deleting all terms except for those that are absolutely required for our business. If it's an experimental term, it's gone. Our Overture UK costs actually went down. Our eSpotting costs will as well.

Note to PPC's: It's all about opportunity costs. Raise your prices, there are plenty of routes where I can put that money to better use. Nimrods.


 3:38 pm on Mar 28, 2003 (gmt 0)

Not surprised - Espotting need a min 10p bid to keep/win deals with partners. As for new PPCs, 1p = not attractive to partners. Many of whom are in exclusive contracts for 1+ years already.

I think people need to calm down here and accept that prices rise - because of normal economic forces, competition in making deals etc - this was inevitable. To have believed otherwise was to be naive.

The price of other media buys changes every 6 months, especially when the market changes (like the search market has). It's just something else to factor in.Hopefully it will discourage all those horrible advertisers for affiliate schemes that start unrealistic bid warts against me.

If your bids are at 5p now and will be 10p soon, and that makes your ROI completely disappear, what are you/your client selling with such a low margin for profit? The good traffic terms that convert are above 10p as
several members have already said - PPC is an auction after all.

Seem to remember the same sort of emotionally comments being posted when Overture did this. This is business people, calm down!


 10:24 pm on Mar 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

Makes Google Ad-Words even better. We pay 5 cents or around 3p a click through.


 7:44 pm on Mar 31, 2003 (gmt 0)

GBP 10p =~ USD $0.16
that's 60% more than overture :(


 7:46 pm on Mar 31, 2003 (gmt 0)

But the same price as Overture UK


 8:41 pm on Mar 31, 2003 (gmt 0)

Don't the staff at ESpotting have a brain? I mean, if Overture do it, then so should we.

At least they could have come up with a different min amount. It indicates to me who the market leader is - Overture.


 10:20 am on Apr 9, 2003 (gmt 0)

eSpottings price increase has opportunities :)

I think there is no point in getting upset about the price increase. Afterall, there is really nothing you can do about it.

However, why not look at the new situation and make the best of it. For instance, as there is no grandfathered status for keywords with eSpotting, I decided to raise all my minimum bid keys already to the new min. bid amount of 10p. eSpotting works on a 1st come, 1st served basis, i.e. I am top of all the min. bids for my current keys :D

anyway, just wanted to lift the spirits a bit with this tip...

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