| 10:12 am on Feb 20, 2002 (gmt 0)|
Hi Wolves - Welcome to WebmasterWorld :)
Lycos paid inclusion [search.lycos.com]
Fast PartnerSite [fastsearch.com]
We've been talking about it here [webmasterworld.com]
| 12:27 pm on Feb 20, 2002 (gmt 0)|
The deal with Fast PartnerSite vs Lycos.com's InSite vs Lycos.Europe PFI product is still unclear.
To me, and I did not sign up to either, it appears as if to pay Fast would bring me into all Lycos portals plus I get a site search.
When I pay for InSite, I might end up not showing up at Lycos Europe, and vice versa.
But perhaps someone who did sign up will know more?
| 5:21 pm on Feb 22, 2002 (gmt 0)|
Well, their wording sure sucks! At first glance, it appears that the cost is $18.00 annualy for a site.
|Annual Membership: $18.00 |
|Full refresh of your site content every 48 hours. |
But when you go in to subscribe, you find that that's just for the privilege of paying yet more money:
|Lycos InSite Select costs $18.00/year plus $12.00 per page |
And still their wording is misleading. Here is the wording for their 10-page example:
|$138 ($18/yr and $12 for 10 pages) |
To an English speaking person, "$18/yr and $12 for 10 pages" would equal $30.00.
At any rate, they DO still offer free submission, but with the usual 4 to 6 week wait, and it is not guaranteed. In a break from the usual extortion we are now being charged across the net, it also appears that free submission is limited to one page of your site.
| 5:53 pm on Feb 22, 2002 (gmt 0)|
Laisha, so talking about the US english version of Lycos it should be noted the prices have actually been lowered compared to first announcements..;)
The whole thing has been reworked since I last checked.
This is what they state in bold on the first productpage for InSite Select [searchservices.lycos.com]:
|LIMITED TIME |
Annual Membership: $18.00
Annual Cost per URL: $12.00
What you get is this:
-Guaranteed inclusion within 48 hours
-Full refresh every 48 hours
-Guaranteed inclusion for a full year
-Personalized Site Submission Reports
Is it worth it?
I guess it's aimed at the lazy and inexperienced websiteowner. Also if you have a crucial page in your site that you need to have in there. Plus it might be good for experimenting.
But submitting a whole site? Hmmm.
| 7:58 pm on Feb 22, 2002 (gmt 0)|
I just went ahead and used the new pay-for-spidering option. I figured it could be worth the $30 experimentation.
Funny though... They immediately ran through the site and upon checking the status of the URL... It offered to go ahead and spider the other78 pages on the site... Which, would be great... But, then, I saw my *confirm transaction* form... With a total of $936.00 due!!! Safe to say, I canceled that one!
| 8:15 pm on Feb 22, 2002 (gmt 0)|
Eric, did you consider spending money on Fast PartnerSite? If so, why did you choose Lycos.com?
>*confirm transaction* form...
hehe pretty straight forward business tactics...
| 9:48 pm on Feb 22, 2002 (gmt 0)|
Not yet heini... But only for this reason...
That Lycos spider means some serious business. And, I want to take it one step at a time so that I can measure the value of each. I will most likely proceed with the FAST inclusion too if neccessary.
Back to Lycos...
It came in and did more of a deep crawl than I have ever seen any spider go about with. Honestly, I had to check back to my account to make sure they (Lycos) did not go through and spider all of my links for $12 a piece!
Thankfully, looking into the logs proved to show that they indexed much more.
The user agent that they send out shows itself as:
...According to their documentation, the site should be included on the 24th. I will be watching closely, thats for sure!
| 10:03 pm on Feb 22, 2002 (gmt 0)|
Now we know why Lycos still has their own spiders...
So, I guess the main difference between the three products - Lycos.com InSite, Fast PartnerSite and Lycos.Europe PFI - is the 48H refreshment: you get that only at the respective point of inclusion.
So while with Fast you get included to all three, neither Lycos.com nor Lycos.europe will refresh your listings on a 48h basis when submitted via Fast PartnerSite.
To get that you have to submit to the respective Lycos program.
| 2:32 pm on Feb 24, 2002 (gmt 0)|
I signed up over 1 month ago with the Lycos.de beta version it haven't worked yet.
I cannot remember the name of the spider it's something like Fast 3.0
It's not the one that Eric mentions.
| 5:58 pm on Feb 24, 2002 (gmt 0)|
I get the Lycos modspider all the time and am not in their paid program. What I still don't understand is when (or if) this is coming out in the UK?
As far as I can make out, FAST paid inclusion clients can't be in Europe - nor can Lycos.com clients. Which leaves Lycos.de for German speaking users.
Clear as mud :(
| 9:00 pm on Feb 24, 2002 (gmt 0)|
Lycos.co.uk has an offer in the works - or is it up already?
here's the url: https://secure.lycos.de/luk/service/addasite.html
It's pwd protected.
| 1:36 pm on Feb 25, 2002 (gmt 0)|
I'm confused, do you pay $18 membership fee each time you submit a new url or is it $18 to become a member for a year and they just charge you for the urls you submit each time you log in?
| 1:39 pm on Feb 25, 2002 (gmt 0)|
>I'm confused, do you pay $18 membership fee each time you submit a new url or is it $18 to become a member for a year and they just charge you for the urls you submit each time you log in?
It is $18 for a membership, then $12 for each individual URL for inclusion.
| 3:34 pm on Feb 25, 2002 (gmt 0)|
New press release [fastsearch.com] on Fast states very clearly that Fast will not offer PartnerSite to the user directly.
Only at the resellers, with Lycos.com as the first one, submission will be possible.
Also for all folks interested in Fast and especially PartnerSite a new exhaustive article at pandia.com [fastsearch.com] is recommendable.
I know, this is not what all you Euro/UK folks have been waiting for....
| 3:35 pm on Feb 25, 2002 (gmt 0)|
Well, going to the Fast PartnerSite page they refer to Lycos as their North American reseller (that's InSite) and The German Lycos for international customers.
The German site doesn't seem to be updated regarding the InSite service.
Anyway, if you really want to have the entire site spidered there's the InSite Pro
- 1-250 Pages: $189.00/month
- 251-500 Pages: $279.00/month
A quick calculation shows that the discount kick is at the 188th URL. (Then, for some reason, it gets expensive again at 251 URLs. Weird.)
Anyway, the introductory price is nice in comparison to Inktomi's revised prices. For 10 URLs you pay $264 at Inktomi and $138 at Lycos (Fast).
| 6:34 pm on Feb 25, 2002 (gmt 0)|
Real time updating?
The feature that it will spider your site and offer to index every other page (and appropriate fee) seems great. I was contemplating doing these paid deep-submits after relaunching a client's site, but generating the hundreds/thousands of URLs seemed aggravating.
I don't know if I would use it, or just submit the 100-200 pages that are going to be really SE friendly, but if they use any sort of link popularity, having all the pages in their database will likely help.
However, what about real time updating. If we add more pages, do I need to manually add them? Will the robot find them anyway and index them? Will the robot find them and charge me?
If I have to go and update it every week I'll lose my mind.
| 6:44 pm on Feb 25, 2002 (gmt 0)|
I have 1st page PR in both Lycos and All the Web for my KW’s and that’s for several sites - yet my Log files show very few referals if any.
| 10:17 pm on Feb 25, 2002 (gmt 0)|
So what you are aiming at is the InSitepro Version, which comes with a Fast based site search for your site.
The way I understand this Lycos has a member/controll center, where you tell the spider which pages to crawl.
Once you set this up the spider will visit you at least each 48 hours.
But I'm not sure on the exact technical details of the administration. Perhaps you could send an inquiry to Lycos - I'd expect them to be rather responsive on this matter.
Interesting little TEASER from Fast, given out via above mentioned Pandia article:
"Fast and Lycos is planning reports on keyword ranking and keyword click-throughs."
(edited by: heini at 10:23 pm (utc) on Feb. 25, 2002)
| 10:21 pm on Feb 25, 2002 (gmt 0)|
following my almost $900+ transaction, I found out that there was an error within making a transaction, and two different cards were billed.
It gave me an error, saying "an invalide credit card number has been entered" Low and behold though, they've both got $30 charges!
Anyways, I emailed them and called them on the error. They emailed back, apologetic, and stated that a $30 refend has been granted to one account.
So far, I've seen the Lycos Mod-Spider come in and play till it turns blue. Yet, searching lycos and fast both for the domain name (without the "www") in the search box... yields nothing.
Another funny thing? They claimed on Friday, the 22d, that my site would appear within the indexes by the 24th. And, I'm thinking today is the 25th.
Ah well, nothing like money well wasted. Er, spent!
| 12:36 am on Feb 26, 2002 (gmt 0)|
Eric - so I thought they were out of beta...
Update on European PFI at Lycos.de:
|up to 100 URLs |
first URL 38 Euro,
following URL 19 Euro each
Up to 250 URLs 2450 €.
Up to 500 URLs 3950 €
all fees annual
Still in beta.
| 1:45 am on Feb 26, 2002 (gmt 0)|
>> Eric - so I thought they were out of beta...
...And so *did* my credit cards. Then again, I'm thankful that I didn't see charges on my accounts for $900+!
Looking into the logs reveals nothing as well. This is my quick summarization:
Submitted on 02/22/02
Supposed to be indexed and included on 02/24/02
Spiders Refresh every 48 hours.
...Spiders came on 02/24/02, but not since. Today, 020/25 - the site has not been spidered once by Lycos ModSpider or any other Lycos/Fast agents.
Seems like a hole in the wallet to me!
| 5:00 am on Feb 26, 2002 (gmt 0)|
>>I signed up over 1 month ago with the Lycos.de beta version it haven't worked yet.
I cannot remember the name of the spider it's something like Fast 3.0
It's not the one that Eric mentions.<<
Try looking under your logfile's "browsers" list. (That's where the Fast spider has been turning up in my logfile.)
| 7:40 am on Feb 26, 2002 (gmt 0)|
>Are my search result rankings enhanced or affected by my participation in FAST PartnerSite?
No. Participating in the FAST PartnerSite program does not alter or enhance your result rankings. Providing searchers with premium, credible and relevant search results is what had made FAST a leading search provider for the web, and the integrity of our results will continue to take precedent.
> How are submitted pages ranked?
Submitted pages are ranked using the identical relevancy algorithms as all other pages in the index.
So, pay for nothing?? I mean, they give no benefit to your page, the algo is based on the site scale, so 1 page will not work...
Am I wrong??
| 2:00 pm on Feb 26, 2002 (gmt 0)|
"Participating in the FAST PartnerSite program does not alter or enhance your result rankings."
Neon, based on the wording you presented, it certainly sounds as though there is no benefit. Fast: "Give us money." Customer: "Will it affect anything?"- Fast:"No, not at all but give us money anyway." Sounds like what happens in a dark alley.
Gotta laugh at that, I guess.
| 2:00 pm on Feb 26, 2002 (gmt 0)|
No, you pay for spidering (P4S). That way your pages get indexed more frequently. If you change a page, the SE's database will reflect that in a few days rather than a few weeks. ;)
In addition you may get some extra benefits in the form of reports.
|the algo is based on the site scale, so 1 page will not work |
Apparently other pages of your site may be spidered as well, but they'll not be indexed that often.
| 2:16 pm on Feb 26, 2002 (gmt 0)|
>Submitted pages are ranked using the identical relevancy algorithms as all other pages in the index
Thanks for pointing this out NeoN. I take that as a promise. If Fast really gave PFI pages a boost in ranking, it would seriously hurt their credibility and the quality of their serps.
BUT: having the chance to get you site reindexed each 24-48 hours leaves you with a lot of room for experimenting... studying the algo... being able to react fast on changes...
I for one can imagine a few scenarios in which having just one page of a site in the paid inclusion program would make a lot of sense.
| 4:23 pm on Feb 26, 2002 (gmt 0)|
FWIW I paid up my $30 dollars yesterday and have gone from nowhere, for our target keywords, to number two in both alltheweb and lycos.com
| 4:29 pm on Feb 26, 2002 (gmt 0)|
was the page indexed before you paid?
| 5:24 pm on Feb 26, 2002 (gmt 0)|
Thats an interesting question. The site was indexed but not the index.html page and the page that was listed had slipped on our target search words. In alltheweb we were at number 1 or 2 for the last few months but only if the exact phrase box was checked. On Lycos.com we had slipped from number 1 to number 5 and then nowhere to be seen.
Now we have the correct page indexed (the one we want users to enter by) and this is at number 2.
| This 39 message thread spans 2 pages: 39 (  2 ) > > |