topr8
msg:848272 | 2:20 pm on Jan 18, 2005 (gmt 0) |
| "if I don’t use/know flash I can’t be a web designer, end of story". |
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give yourself a specalist web title something like ... information architect
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benihana
msg:848273 | 2:28 pm on Jan 18, 2005 (gmt 0) |
you design websites, dont you? therefore: you = web designer I think your colleague maybe got things back to front, its flash specialists who cannot write a scrap of html who should not be called web designers. (disclaimer: i realise there are many who can do both extremely well) | I’ll go to the bar, if only I could find it, who designed this place....? |
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LOL :)
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smokeyb
msg:848274 | 2:39 pm on Jan 18, 2005 (gmt 0) |
And of course it's a bit ironic when all the Flash banners and bits & bobs I see, have the tell-tale signs of 3rd party .swf output software!(no Flash knowledge needed). Probably because most people (like me) leave the software behind after learning it, and use quickfixes when someone really wants a Flash banner... If they're talking pure Flash websites, then that's definitely a specialist area, reserved for those people who have 25 hour days.
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limbo
msg:848275 | 3:22 pm on Jan 18, 2005 (gmt 0) |
| you design websites, dont you? therefore: you = web designer |
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Yes, but if I make this assumption it may alienate prospective employers. I am in the business & have been for long enough to create sites that are useable, well ranked, acccessible.... The problem for me here, is the perception of others on my current skills, not my own perception of web design (with which I was very happy). Sure when I have a foot through the door I can begin the remonstrations, but pushing myself down the employability scale due to lack of experience in a arena that has yet to prove its worth... its a horrible notion.
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limbo
msg:848276 | 3:31 pm on Jan 18, 2005 (gmt 0) |
Could do, but what then? I design webste sites not just the site structure. Including page layout, type, colour, icons, css, visuals, etc etc..... this to me says Designer not IA? | reserved for those people who have 25 hour days. |
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Yes, exactly :)
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BeeDeeDubbleU
msg:848277 | 3:33 pm on Jan 18, 2005 (gmt 0) |
I think therefore I am :)
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HelenDev
msg:848278 | 4:06 pm on Jan 18, 2005 (gmt 0) |
I think web developer is still the best description. I call myself that and I'm no expert on servers and such things, although I try to know a little about all aspects of web stuff. I think Web designer implies you only know about the creative side and not about any technical stuff. I'm not a big fan of Flash, but I do get asked to do stuff with it every now and again, so I know just enough about it to do simple things - usually people just want something that looks cool and contains a link - and I think that's just enough to put it on my CV.
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benihana
msg:848279 | 9:31 pm on Jan 18, 2005 (gmt 0) |
| alienate prospective employers. |
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there will always be some potential employers that want flash, just as there will be ones that want php, xml, asp, javascript ... etc ad infinitum. then again, there will also be ones that are more concerned with
| sites that are useable, well ranked, acccessible.... |
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smokeyb
msg:848280 | 9:39 pm on Jan 18, 2005 (gmt 0) |
Something occured to me that disputes that comment "I couldn’t call myself a web designer if I don't know how to use it", and that is that in the main I don't use Flash for the web. It is better used to make cartoons and games that wouldn't be viable for use on the net. In truth Flash has evolved way beyond simple bouncy text and cosmic navigation systems, and is utilised by many other types of professionals. So the question is: Is an animator not an animator if he can't use Flash? or: Is a game developer not one if he can't either? or: Is flash just a versatile piece of software that may or may not be used according to preference?..
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benihana
msg:848281 | 9:55 pm on Jan 18, 2005 (gmt 0) |
| versatile piece of software that may or may not be used according to preference |
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well said. :)
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limbo
msg:848282 | 3:57 pm on Jan 19, 2005 (gmt 0) |
| versatile piece of software that may or may not be used according to preference |
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Yes indeed. We have a team member who uses this to make interactive CD Roms (he is a multimedia designer). I think on balance it would be an idea to glean a little knowledge, as Helen says, do enough to action script a little graphic here and there, plop a reference to it on my CV and then forget about it. ....for now.....
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choster
msg:848283 | 6:50 pm on Jan 19, 2005 (gmt 0) |
I thought everybody nowadays was just a "consultant" anyway :).
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twist
msg:848284 | 3:28 am on Jan 21, 2005 (gmt 0) |
By your co-workers logic that if you don't know how to build flash applications then you aren't a web developer, wouldn't that also apply that if you don't know how to create videos from scratch (mpeg, wmv, avi) that you are also not a web designer? For that matter, what about shockwave or java? A .swf is no different than a .jpg. All the web developer has to know how to do is put them on the web, not how to create them.
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pxp25
msg:848285 | 8:39 pm on Jan 21, 2005 (gmt 0) |
I had similair delima when I applied for a Web designer position nearly a year ago. I know a little about flash but I know enough to know that Flash is not appropriate on all type of sites. I was applying for the position with a catalog company that has a big chunk of its sale coming from the their retail website. To the retail site that rely on fast download and search engine traffic to general sale flash was not appropriate(too heavy/too long to load and it is a just a black box to search engine.) Better site navigation and quick download are more important.
There are situations and sites where the use of Flash is appropriate, for example art gallery, design firm, interactive sites, on and on where the look of the site is more important that download time and search engine traffic. What I am trying to say is knowing something like Flash is good idea for a web designer but more importantly knowing when, where and why to use or not to use it is most important. I got that job BTW not because I know flash but it was because I know it enough to know when, where and why to use it. I hope this help from another web designer
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Nicola
msg:848286 | 12:16 pm on Jan 28, 2005 (gmt 0) |
I got turned down for a job in a big design firm, because I was too much of a "Jack of All Trades". Web design firms like to compartmentalise their employees IMO. An all rounder is considered useful in smaller companies.
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george123
msg:848287 | 12:54 pm on Jan 28, 2005 (gmt 0) |
one think you should know, there are different schools of web design like in art history, in Europe (Swedish-German school....the best) is the gray cold bg or black green .underdeveloped in web design countries use flash, US uses a mix of both.
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too much information
msg:848288 | 1:48 pm on Jan 28, 2005 (gmt 0) |
Personally I am really bad at the graphic design stuff, but I can recreate any design you give me. So I don't know if I would call myself a designer. In construction the architect does the design, the civil engineer makes it work, and the contractor puts it on the ground. I guess in my case I would be the engineer and contractor. *I knew I should be charging more!
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krieves
msg:848289 | 4:02 pm on Jan 28, 2005 (gmt 0) |
My title is Website Manager, even though, for the most part I do all the work. I create the graphics and photography, website design, code the HTML and JavaScript, write copy and create content, while interfacing with the business units to make sure their interests are represented. The only thing I don't do is the server maintenance (thank goodness we have a tech services area that maintains hardware). After reading what I just wrote, I think I deserve a raise. :)
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