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This 69 message thread spans 3 pages: 69 ( [1] 2 3 > >     
Yahoo Says It will Switch to Inktomi First Quarter
yankee




msg:844106
 5:03 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

Bad time for an IPO. From Yahoo's earning's release yesterday:
[zdnet.com.com...]

"Yahoo on Wednesday said it will drop search partner Google during the first quarter of 2004 in favor of its own technology, opening a new phase in the battle for Web search dominance."

 

lasko




msg:844107
 5:36 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)


Let the battle commence!

Can't wait, the extra competition will be a good thing as many will understand the current situation is that if you are punished in Google you will suffer in yahoo instantly.

I like the bit where it says when MSN get their act together! which will be when Bush makes it to the moon!

rmjvol




msg:844108
 5:41 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

I think Danny's comments in the article were pretty good. [You can relax now, Danny ;)]

Google's not currently getting much out of the Yahoo relationship. The branding benefit is past, especially with no Google logo anymore and the recent "Yahoo Search" promotions. Joe Surfer has no idea that Google was driving these results and, Yahoo hopes, won't even notice the change.

It certainly makes a big difference to us but I don't think it hurts G significantly.

rmjvol

pleeker




msg:844109
 5:46 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

Bad time for an IPO.

Not necessarily, considering the article points out that it'll have no impact on the reach of Google's advertising revenue.

Besides, everyone has known this was coming. If it was to cause such a dramatic impact on G, the bankers wouldn't let them schedule the IPO this spring. :)

The main question is what the impact will be on Y. Is the new algo ready for prime time? Clearly Y thinks so, but will web surfers?

kanetrain




msg:844110
 5:47 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

Normal sufer is going to notice the change in a big way IMHO. Ink has some work to do before they can compete. I sure hope they have something up their sleve.

If they release Ink too early, Yahoo users are just going to go right over to google and stay. I am excited about the possibility of more competition in the search market, but current INk results are just really quite poor. That's just my opinion. I'm sure there are others with differing views.

woop01




msg:844111
 5:55 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

They're going with INK so soon? Hmm, time to start cooking some more spam.

worker




msg:844112
 6:00 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

Joe surfer may or may not notice right away, but the media is going to be all over Yahoo once it changes.

All it is going to take is a few 'What's wrong with Yahoo Search' articles after the change, and Joe Surfer will begin deserting.

I would love for Yahoo to be competitive, but everytime I review Ink. search results I'm so underwhelmed that I have to go to another engine and try again.

Kicking Google out appears to me to be a result of Google going public, and not due to Ink. now being a competitive engine.

Mardi_Gras




msg:844113
 6:03 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

>Kicking Google out appears to me to be a result of Google going public, and not due to Ink. now being a competitive engine.

Probably more a result of paying $235 million for Ink and the current contract coming up for renewal... you can't spend that kind of money without doing something with the company, unless maybe you are MS.

andy_boyd




msg:844114
 6:20 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

Gonna have to get those pages optimized for Yahoo/Ink soon, or a third of my traffic will vanish.

EquityMind




msg:844115
 6:28 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

I believe the contract with Google was merely for licensing the engine for about $5MM, so in the grand scheme of things if Google did $1BB last year, this doesnt affect them at all and as was pointed out earlier, average Joe surfer shouldn't notice anything dramatic. The only ones who will REALLY notice is us since we pay such close attention to relevance.

I launched a ton of paid inclusion and began optimizing for Ink last quarter and it has paid off handsomely giving me about a 350% return on investment - and this is BEFORE MSN drops LookSmart tomorrow and BEFORE Yahoo switches over to Ink. Nice.

EquityMind

worker




msg:844116
 6:33 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

True Mardi_Gras, but when you buy a fixer-upper house, you can find yourself up to your elbows in problems if you move in too soon.

They would be better off working on the Ink. search results until the marketplace is singing it's praises as a true competitor to Google. Then they could make the switch and actually grow because of it.

As it stands now, I think they are risking all the marketing they have done with the Yahoo Search brand.

Mardi_Gras




msg:844117
 6:38 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

>when you buy a fixer-upper house, you can find yourself up to your elbows in problems if you move in too soon

Don't I know it! Time will tell if that is the situation Yahoo is putting themselves into.

mayor




msg:844118
 6:42 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

Everyone keeps talking as if Joe or Jane surfer are stupid and will not follow Google to their home site when Yahoo dumps them. I wouldn't bet a lot of money on that.

przero2




msg:844119
 6:43 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

I read some where here that Ink that Yahoo will use is entirely different from what we see as Ink today. If so, how can we know anything about YahooInk.

Mardi_Gras




msg:844120
 6:46 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

>Everyone keeps talking as if Joe or Jane surfer are stupid

Not stupid, but uninformed. I can't imagine any "typical user" who - short term - will stop using Yahoo as a portal/search engine because the search results are not from Google. The actual change wil be a non-event to the vast majority of surfers out there. Now, long term, that is another question, and I think it depends on how quickly Yahoo gets Ink up to speed.

MarkHutch




msg:844121
 6:49 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

This is going to be interesting to watch. From my point of view, Ink is no where as good as Google. If Yahoo doesn't build in some increase speed into Inks recrawling of the web, the data will be old and usless in most cases except where people are paying to have their pages crawled every couple of days.

figment88




msg:844122
 6:49 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

I thought the article said switching to "their own search technology" NOT Inktomi.

Doesn't it leave the possibility open for AV, Inktomi, use of their directory, or some hybrid?

I would think that Yahoo would not want to have the exact same SERPs as MSN.

Mardi_Gras




msg:844123
 6:54 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

> I thought the article said switching to "their own search technology" NOT Inktomi.

Well, Inktomi is their own technology :) But I think (in my totally uneducated opinion) that it is reasonable to believe that what Yahoo rolls out will not be Ink as we now see it. I would expect a little more flash and splash - hard to promote old Ink results as a great new thing for the user.

rmjvol




msg:844124
 6:58 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

I thought the article said switching to "their own search technology" NOT Inktomi.

Just beat me to it so "me, too."

<added>Whoops. [internetnews.com...]
"Our short-term goal will be to have [the Yahoo! network throughout] the entire world using our algorithmic search in Inktomi," said Terry Semel, CEO of Yahoo!</added>

...Joe or Jane surfer are stupid and will not follow Google to their home site when Yahoo dumps them.

I think those that realize that Google powers Y have already done this. I'd expect that the bulk of Yahoo Search users don't know it's Google or don't care.

And remember, the definition of quality SERPs is entirely different here at WebmasterWorld as opposed to in the mind of Joe or Jane. We're a tab more observant & a touch more picky ;)

worker




msg:844125
 7:21 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

That's why the media is going to be the big player in this.

Imagine the difference to Joe Surfer if the New York Times or Time Magazine does an article on 'the new Yahoo Search...YUCK!'.

If the search results aren't impressive, I think that the media could turn into sharks at a feeding frenzy. 'The Search War just got violent, and Yahoo shot off it's own foot!' Those types of things.

I just keep hoping that when they release their new solution, it shocks everyone with how good it is. I also buy lottery tickets because I hope I'll win a million dollars.

Idaho




msg:844126
 8:07 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

I launched a ton of paid inclusion and began optimizing for Ink last quarter

Can someone point me to a thread on basic steps to optimize for Inktomi?

Hunter




msg:844127
 8:08 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

Ok guys and gals, think it's time for a new addition to our WebmasterWorld slang? ...what about "Yahink"

CygnusX1




msg:844128
 9:09 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

Am I the only one that this change won't effect at all? I read so many post about how everyone doesn't like google and likes Ink better. I do the exact same on both, no matter what keyword phrase I try to go after.

I want to know if there is anyone else out there that does well in both search engines like I do?

steveb




msg:844129
 10:34 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

Yahoo has been hugely profitable with what they have. They'd just be plain fools to switch to Ink, which not only has results the public has rejected for years, it now can't even keep its pfi sites listed.

Yahoo going to straight Ink would mean billions to Google, and disaster for Yahoo. They have to know that. On the other hand, a mix of AV, AlltheWeb, a bit from Ink and the Yahoo Directory could lead to very good results, especially with an emphasis on the Directory.

As webmasters it is not in our interest to see Yahoo make a fool of itself by using Ink. Google will become too supremely powerful, with only MSN in the distant wings to possibly offer genuine competition.

Kbug44




msg:844130
 11:08 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

I am very interested to see if Yahoo will be changing the INK results when they finally switch. Why have they been waiting so long, I have to wonder? I faintly remember certain deals being in place but aren't they over? Can't they switch anytime?

Bobby




msg:844131
 11:16 pm on Jan 15, 2004 (gmt 0)

On the other hand, a mix of AV, AlltheWeb, a bit from Ink and the Yahoo Directory could lead to very good results, especially with an emphasis on the Directory.

Well put steveb those are my exact feelings.

Ever since the Florida update I've had the feeling that directories may be on their way back.
A good mix of Altavista (which in my opinion has the best quality results, ATW for its depth and Inktomi for its low cost PFI will undoubtedly present a viable alternative to the G.

sysdomatic




msg:844132
 12:04 am on Jan 16, 2004 (gmt 0)

From a business and search relevance point of view, Yahoo would be well-served to put a big emphasis on sites listed in their Yahoo Directory. Not only would people be more willing to cough up $$$ to list in the Directory, but the search results would be very good, considering that the Directory is maintained by humans.

Kirby




msg:844133
 12:06 am on Jan 16, 2004 (gmt 0)

>I want to know if there is anyone else out there that does well in both search engines like I do?

I do. Its a nice position to be in.

>On the other hand, a mix of AV, AlltheWeb, a bit from Ink and the Yahoo Directory could lead to very good results, especially with an emphasis on the Directory.

Good results is not the most important thing to Y! at the moment, as Joe Surfer is slow to notice. The benefit to Y! using pure INK with M$N is the combined market share and bragging rights. Also serves as a useful diversion as it gives the media statistical fodder in their focus on Google and the IPO.

steveb




msg:844134
 12:27 am on Jan 16, 2004 (gmt 0)

"Why have they been waiting so long, I have to wonder?"

Because they knew Ink could not compete with Google.

Mardi_Gras




msg:844135
 12:33 am on Jan 16, 2004 (gmt 0)

>As webmasters it is not in our interest to see Yahoo make a fool of itself by using Ink.

>Because they knew Ink could not compete with Google.

steveb - A little personal pro-Google bias, perhaps :)

It may not be in your best interest to see Yahoo switch to Ink, but it most certainly is in mine.

This 69 message thread spans 3 pages: 69 ( [1] 2 3 > >
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