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This 179 message thread spans 6 pages: < < 179 ( 1 2 3 4 5 [6]     
Datacenter Watch: 2006-07-04

 6:18 pm on Jul 4, 2006 (gmt 0)

< continued from [webmasterworld.com...] >

In doing searches for topics that I am interested in, but unrelated to my sites, I have noticed it takes longer to find good pages. Just a year or so ago, I could find four to eight good web pages on the first page. Now, sometimes I find one or none on the first page. Some keyword phrases are so bad they have been literally crippled to search with.

This is not really Google's fault. The web is just getting littered with all kinds of 'high tech' tricky stuff to make web sites easily and get traffic quickly. I assume this is to make a quick buck. A real driving force is the fact that people can put pay-per-click ads on their very own sites for free. These types of ads, such as Google's own Adsense is a great idea, but there is bound to be a downside to every new thing.

I am sure Google is trying hard to fix these problems because I am seeing different results every few weeks or so for the same search phrases. The phrases I check the most are ones that bring my own web sites up on the first page. This way I can tell how much of my traffic is coming from the search engines.

Luckily my web sites rank pretty much the same, but the other sites that are ranked above and below mine keep changing. Some sites that are ranked near mine help my traffic while others don't. It seems that since there are so many 'trick' sites showing up, that it can be good for you to be next to one. People will notice it is crappy and then visit yours and realize it is better and bookmark it and come back again later.

With the amount of web pages growing fast and the amount of 'quick buck' folks showing up, this situation can only get harder for Google to handle, but imaging having a slew of crap pages all around your listing? Your quality listing will show up very well and your will get higher quality traffic and possibly more of it.

Google is looking into a way to 'register' your domains with them and give you an ever growing 'boost' in ranking for registering as the system grows and matures. The 'bad folks' can then easily be tracked and removed for breaking ethical rules in web design to cheat their way to the top. If these pesky folks decide not to register to 'hide' from Google, then there rankings will start to suffer as legit registered sites get ranked higher. It is like a hybrid of a search engine and a directory.

As for these latest changes. Lots of movement has taken place. My site is the only one that hasn&#8217;t moved on this update. Every other site has moved and a few new ones added. It saddens me to see that a few 'quick buck' sites are now on the same page as mine. But, like I mentioned above, this isn't always a bad thing. I wont be able to tell if it helps my site for a week or so. Sometimes these neighbors of mine can have a huge impact on my traffic from the Google search pages!

Another thing that I have noticed over the past few years is that more and more of the best quality traffic to my sites comes from links on other sites. Google's search pages only provide about 15% of the income earning traffic to my sites. If you 'lose' a ranking on the Google pages, that may not affect your income at all. Get links from other sites similar to yours and watch your quality traffic grow. Trust me it works. I have been doing it for years. People have even said that if you get links Google will actually place your pages higher on theirs! A double bonus in my book!

Besides those links from other sites, add two or three pages per day with information about your topic. These pages will get indexed very fast and other sites will link to the pages. Make sure people can get to the main part of your site from each new page you make. I have read in this forum that adding new pages not only brings links, but once again, Google will move your site above the others just for adding new pages all the time. You don&#8217;t need to add more then two or three a day though. If you run out of subjects start to branch out. Don't write anything boring. People will leave and will forget about the site and wont link to it. Boring things include sales tactics or repeating the same thing over.

On bad thing about making the site with article pages is that you will get TONS of email from sites trying to swap links! It is a royal pain and you should prepare for it. Ironically, most of these people write web sites that try to make a quick buck! (See Above) Someone said that linking to some of these sites will get you ignored by Google! Do not answer these emails and do not swap links! Don't let these bad guys stop you from adding to your site. Also be ready for bad guys that want to buy links from you. Google might ignore you if you link to them. I am not sure if Google is trying to keep these crappy sites from getting links, but the less they have, the less people that will visit them and they will give up an go away! We can only hope.

In the time some of us spend checking the Google data servers, we could have written one good article on our very own site.

Good luck with your web site...

[edited by: tedster at 1:57 am (utc) on July 7, 2006]



 9:10 am on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)

>>>>Google.co.uk is not showing cache links or similar pages links next to their search results today. <<<<<

It is from where I am sitting.... (London)

[edited by: Ellio at 9:11 am (utc) on July 20, 2006]


 11:02 am on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)

Hi Ellio,

Yep, all back again now. Must have been a short glitch ealier in the morning.


 11:04 am on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)

if we are serious not much has happen the last 18 month in this issue, most how write in this thread are webmasters hows site has been in troubles, with ether non www, 302 redirecting from other sitres, supplemental just because a description looks the same, omitted results, 301 redirecting and most of the sites that was hurt was a good stables sites.

Now today I see that also my index page is missing well thats a new one, that site has gone through HELL for 18 month and google are not happy when a webmaster has sites in same category, but that is a must when google owns the internet and they have such troubles with there index, they dont even have hardware enogh for all the sites they are indexing and that is maybe there biggest problem.


 12:07 pm on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)


As you know I have suffered from this problem too for a long time - I have seen more and more sites get effected with very few getting fixed.

Personally I have totally given up on a fix for the issue.


 12:45 pm on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)

Does any of you know how a penalty expires. I mean I have a site that has been 250 position for months, lately is jumping from 400 to 40, and this is going on for about 3/4 weeks, is my penalty expiring?


 1:47 pm on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)

Dayo : its realy hard times, still waiting for relief when VISTA comes next year then google will maybe just have less then 50% of all search, that will be good times. Dont get me wrong I liked google until they added all those "sites" where they reached 8bill thats when everything went wrong.

Alex70 : why do you think you have a penalty, we are not talking Yahoo here, google has a filter to fix stuff, have you ever ranked with the site?


 2:03 pm on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)

Zeus, I have 13 travel related websites, almost all of them reached the first 30 positions at once. Few of them are still in the 1st page ( 58 millions pages ..today )


 2:09 pm on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)

ohh if they realy gor first in no time, it can be that you are now in the sandbox because its a VERY competiv area.


 2:22 pm on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)

IMHO the sandbox is the period for a site to recover from a penalty, or?


 6:04 pm on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)

Maybe Google doesn't want 13 sites all from the same company in the top 30. Maybe they see that as an attempt to spam their index, and acted accordingly?


 10:32 pm on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)

13 sites from one company in one sector is spam as far as Google is concerned.

Does not help the searcher much either....


 10:34 pm on Jul 20, 2006 (gmt 0)

I ask again:

<<<As Google is updating its index "constantly" as and when new pages, new links, spam etc are found what exactly is meant by the term "Data Refresh" these days? <<<


 6:39 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)


"what exactly is meant by the term "Data Refresh" these days? <<<

It seems at present that the term "Data Refresh" could cover various changes in the index, including possible changes in algos.

Its therefore we don't hear about official announced updates anymore, IMO.


 7:35 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

"what exactly is meant by the term "Data Refresh" these days? <<<

It seems at present that the term "Data Refresh" could cover various changes in the index, including possible changes in algos.

Its therefore we don't hear about official announced updates anymore, IMO.


Thanks Reseller but it would be good to get a definitive answers as Matt seems to refer to Data Refresh quite often and its an odd term for an algo change.


 7:40 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

"13 sites from one company in one sector is spam as far as Google is concerned"

Does google actually look into the registry data of an url?


 7:50 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

someone needs to explain how 'data refreshes' can hit overnight while conventional updates and data shifts can take weeks to propogate...


 8:20 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

<< 13 sites from one company in one sector is spam as far as Google is concerned. >>
In my sector some one on a single site sells "widget" around Europe, some other sell "widget" on a sigle website for every European city.
Don't think this is spam.


 8:43 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

i think this last data refreshed was inferred as being an iteration...so the result of updating an algo point...in the way page rank is calculated after many run throughs of the index...each run resulting in an update to the former run....page rank is said to need at least 30 runs....

so while some things like keyword density are fixed..other parts of the algo are totally relative such as page rank..but who knows what else...

although keyword density and filters in gernal can be relative to...either relative to how many bad marks you acheieve elsewhere..or even to other sites being returned in the serps...so they may set a sweet point for something at say 80% of the average for that...and as you have no control over the other sites..whther you hit or miss that mark is out of your hands..great for reducing manipulation...the counter for this is up the threshold this kicks in relative to your authority score..thus we see big brands can basically do wotever they want without penalty why mom and pop gets kicked for having two pages with the same title...

[edited by: soapystar at 8:48 am (utc) on July 21, 2006]


 8:46 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

Multiple websites on the same IP may be seen as spam by Google especially if they interlink.

[edited by: Ellio at 8:51 am (utc) on July 21, 2006]


 8:53 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

I have a maximum of 3 websites on a single ip..

[edited by: Alex70 at 8:53 am (utc) on July 21, 2006]


 9:01 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

May be OK if they are in completely different markets.....


 9:14 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

"13 sites from one company in one sector is spam as far as Google is concerned."

Nonsense. Who owns a website is completely irrelevant to how useful it is in answering a searcher's query. Duplicate sites, sure, that's a problem, but making multiple unique sites on a topic certainly isn't spam, or anything close to it.


 9:35 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

One of my websites is jumping from 40 to 400 position and back. The only reason that could couse such behaviour IMO is the average of web pages uploaded/changed on a period of time. I think that google likes more one page added every day than 30 pages per month.
Does this make sence?


 10:44 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

Does this make sence?

not really. Not that simplistically anyway.


 11:21 am on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

Lets think for a sec that google may have infrastructures problems after bigdaddy or just an implemented way of spidering ( see goglebot strange behaviour lately, cahce out dated etc)
Lets now think tha I have to add 30 pages per month on a website.
Ok, what I think is that google want me to add a single page daily instead of 30 pages monthly, and this explain my up and down...


 12:43 pm on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

well, do you think the bods at google believe all information and articles are one page articles and projects? Do you think it hasnt occured to thm that new information on websites might have to include sub pages? related pages?

so uploading one a day isnt possible..theres a bunch of pages linking to each other..

of course uploading 30 pages might be seen differently to uploading 1000 pages..or it might be relative to the size of your site and past chnages to your website..in other words patterns...


 12:52 pm on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

Lets say you have a 1000 pages website and you have 10 articles ( total 100 pages )ready to go online, would you add the 10 articles on your website all at once or would you spread it in a longher period of time?


 3:13 pm on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

Are you guys showing gfe-ro and gfe-ro2 missing data? On certain searches, the # of results is a lot less [I wouldn't have noticed if one of my sites hadn't had the index page disappear from its #1 position held for a few years and move out past 1000].


 4:24 pm on Jul 21, 2006 (gmt 0)

Ok, what I think is that google want me to add a single page daily instead of 30 pages monthly, and this explain my up and down...

But only if you are eating mature Camembert and drinking a good red wine at the same time LOL. Where the heck did you get that theory from.

There is something very broken with Google and the reason that you are jumping from 40 to 400 is because you are seeing results at different times from data centres.

FWIW unless your site is in an unusual subject area IMHO you might as well be at #400 as #40.


< continued here: [webmasterworld.com...] >

[edited by: tedster at 7:48 pm (utc) on July 21, 2006]

This 179 message thread spans 6 pages: < < 179 ( 1 2 3 4 5 [6]
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