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What can you do when Google doesn't act on spam reports?
HuhuFruFru

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 3:18 pm on Jul 3, 2006 (gmt 0)

I have wrote spam reports to Google.com and Google.de about a spammer who is using some kind of 5 billion-pages-style spam, copying thousands of articles from my website, but Google simply won't react.

I really wouldn't care but for some keywords these sites even rank better than my own site (which is the original!). Those spam-pages are not even two months old and I wonder how they did that.

I have lost at least half of my Adsense earnings in the last week just because of lost traffic. Traffic which is going to some spammer who is copying content from my site and thousands others, putting it on thousands of .info-domains with another thousands of subdomains and interlinking them with each other.

Is there any advice you can give me?
It seems there is nothing I can do against this kind of spam :/

 

trillianjedi

WebmasterWorld Senior Member trillianjedi us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 2:47 pm on Jul 5, 2006 (gmt 0)

Msg 17 warranted a thread in it's own right so split from here and now residing here [webmasterworld.com]

europeforvisitors



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 3:23 pm on Jul 5, 2006 (gmt 0)

Jeff, I think Brett's point is that--as others have pointed out here--spam and content theft are different issues even though content thieves may also be spammers. The way to fight content theft is with a DMCA complaint, not a spam report, if your objective is to have stolen material removed from Google's search listings.

HuhuFruFru

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 3:29 pm on Jul 5, 2006 (gmt 0)

You know I'm not talking about a spammer who has put one or two pages online - of course it's clear that Google couldn't react to every such case.

But the spammer I'm talking about has AT LEAST thousands of domains and for each domain thousands of subdomains online and I have talked to many webmasters in Germany about it.

We simply cannot explain why Google is not responding. For very popular keywords those pages rank very well and it's so frustrating when a person comes, puts those junk online and after three weeks he outranks websites which have worked yor YEARS and YEARS on good quality content!

I'm sure someday this guy will be out, question is when? Next week, next month or next year? Adsense earnings are soo low now compared to two weeks ago!

I don't know how many people at Google work against spam, but it's obvious that they don't have enough people to deal with it, although it should be for them the top priority - who wants a SE with thousands of dada232323.dada5345.info-domains!

incrediBILL

WebmasterWorld Administrator incredibill us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 3:33 pm on Jul 5, 2006 (gmt 0)

Lastly incrediBILL, you should go check the copyright office web site. Some of your statements are not correct related to fair use and they clear that up there.

Sites may NOT even paraphrase your content. We get interviewed by the press all the time, and if they do use fair use, they must give credit to our site. That is the difference between legal use of our content, and scraping it and putting it onto a spam page with your own copyright statement.

I'm well aware of the copyright law and all the interpretations by lawyers.

Most spammers/scrapers do nothing more than Google/Yahoo/MSN which built search sites using scraped results without permission and they even make you OPT-OUT, not OPT-IN to do those things.

The precedent is set, so if what the scrapers/spammers do is illegal, so is what Google does except courts have upheld them.

Can't have it both ways.

Regarding hijackings/spam, if you aren't blocking every proxy site on the net you're running a real risk of getting pages hijacked and wasting time removing them. Many of the proxy sites seem to be letting Google crawl thru via a cloaked directory and Google doesn't seem to be smart enough to realize that page belongs to YOU, and not the proxy site.

That's why I bounce every page request that claims to come from Google that's outside their IP range just to keep from getting hijacked in the first place.

Brett_Tabke

WebmasterWorld Administrator brett_tabke us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 8:38 pm on Jul 5, 2006 (gmt 0)

> Every page jacker is a spammer!

So you are calling Google a page jacking spammer? WooHoo... ;-) <grin> The Google cached pages with their branding advertisement on the top (aka: the page jacking of 8billion pages) are no different than any other search engines jacked pages. Or how about archive.org?

There are all kinds of exceptions to the 'page jacker is a spammer' rule. I know alot of page jackers who don't even publish the jacked page to be indexed. Instead, they aggregate it behind closed doors and resell it to interested parties. That is what all those "copyright", "trademark" and "brand" protection agencies do.

> Because they are creating unwanted garbage in the index

It is up to Google to police their own system.
Just last week we had yet-another-arms-race [webmasterworld.com] quote from a search engine. We first heard that quote from Altavista in 1998.

<sidetopic>
Altavista lost that race ;-)
<sidetopic>

Google are the ones that have built their entire service on other peoples work. Whether it is classified as spam (I don't think they do), is up to - and only up to - them to deal with.

My ire was the original post looked like yet-another-attempted at shopping a page to a Google employee - yet another "we'll post it publicly and maybe google will see" it post. It gets old being the conduit for Googles backroom spam reports.

> getting neaten by automated spamming

Sure - down in the nonproductive tail-so-long we will call it "the pit". (it is right under the tail). Seriously - send me some examples of automate spam beating quality pages in quality searches.

> AT LEAST thousands of domains

Sounds like the PPC (Pills, Porn, Casino) area? If that is the case, Google couldn't care less.
I have never seen or heard of google declaring a PPC site to be a "spam" site unless it interfered specifically
with non PPC areas. (eg: cloaking "girl scouts" redirected to underage tgps...which happened yet again recently).

> We simply cannot explain why Google is not responding.

Sure we can. pick a card any card: :-)

- They don't care (eg: ppc arena).
- They don't view it as spam.
- They chose to deal with it in algo. (which is what they always claim).
- They have a current moretorium on deleting anything from the index.
- They don't read spam reports.
- They haven't read their email in days.
- They are too busy trying to crack the wall street algo ;-)
- The spam guru was on vacation for 7 weeks?

incrediBILL

WebmasterWorld Administrator incredibill us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 11:14 pm on Jul 5, 2006 (gmt 0)

That is what all those "copyright", "trademark" and "brand" protection agencies do.

Ah yes, love the spybots.

My favorite spybot has no shame at all and they claim on their site to develop technologies for crawling, monitoring and SCRAPING (I kid you not, thats the word they used) newly posted web content.

FWIW, I had a site left wide open to be deliberately hijacked and it was a few weeks ago, then my site went back on top just above the hijacker last week. Just checked again, now it's completely vanished. Don't know if someone else finked on the cloaker or if Google has figured out how to detect some of them, but it went away.

A real shame too as I wanted to use is as an example!

HuhuFruFru

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 6:22 pm on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

I'm very sick now to watch those info-domains getting *every day* better in the ranking! Every day more domains, more sub-domains, more pages are added, while Google is doing nothing! Absolutely nothing. I talked about it on Matt Cutts' Blog, but somehow my entry is not there any more.

Are they losing control of these spammers? I understand that it must be hard for them to detect those useless pages, but at least they could say they are working on it or sth :/

soapystar

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 6:36 pm on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

its truly remarkable the number of posters that still cling to the old days when googleguy posted about ongoing issues....those days are gone..forget them..have you not noticed the change?....its clear everything they post about google itself is designed for aq wider audience than us...they also only now post about issues they are confident they have overcome or issues they dont believe actually exsisted..if you think you will ever see a post about a geuine ongoing problem with google then good luck!

incrediBILL

WebmasterWorld Administrator incredibill us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 5+ Year Member Top Contributors Of The Month



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 6:54 pm on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

Well soapystar, perhaps Googleguy was on a well deserved vacation from about 5/20 - 6/30 according to his blog but keep those theories coming, we can never have too many of 'em :)

soapystar

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 8:10 pm on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

the problem with waiting to see if a theory is correct is that it takes 100 years till it becomes a law..makes you wonder why any body bothers then dont you think? :)

JeffOstroff

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 8:14 pm on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

I can't stand the .info domain sites, I don't think I ever saw a legit one, they should jsut do away with them.

Maybe there is one legit .info site somewhere, but not that I have seen. Same thing with that stupid .cc nonsense. ,US, and others. It seems like every few months the idiot registrars come up with some new extention as a means to extort more money from the rest of us, because if we don't take out our domain name .xx, then some squatter will. The registrars come out the big winner every time.

They should also make it harder to get .org names, as the mega thousand scraper/directory sites are now abusing .ORG names and ranking well.

ICANN should require anyone who takes out a .org to be a fully registered non-profit organization.

OF course that would just cause scammers to abuse some other 2 letter domain extension.

BTW, I have come with my own 2 letter domain name extension, but it is probably not printable here.

HuhuFruFru

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 8:26 pm on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

maybe they should make make a domain for all those spammers.

www.viagra-cialis.spam

:/

In the past I always one of those who said: "Spam in Google? Where? There is no spam" But today I must really say, that Google is full of spam. And it seems that Yahoo is much cleaner.

Please anyone from Google if you read this: hire more people for the anti-spam-fight, it is the biggest challenge on the Internet imho.

JeffOstroff

5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 8:35 pm on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

Ok, this might open up a can of worms.

Do you think that maybe Google was begind the 5 billion page site that first appeared on 5/31?

It sure seems suspicious how they could so rapidly obtain high ranking on numerous pages in 3 weeks.

Think about it a minute. We see hundreds of people complaining here whose sites have been up for months and they don't even appear in the index, yet all of a sudden 5 billion pages from a web site show up in 3 weeks? With incoming links from where?

Not only that, some of that 5 Billion page web site were outranking our own pages. Sounds like an inside job to me.

Just think how big Google's earnings would be in the July earnings announcement with Adwords income from 5 billion pages.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.....

soapystar

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 10:50 pm on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

i find it E-X-T-R-A-O-R-D-I-N-A-R-Y that nobody bar me :) can see the reason for the current spam....can we please stop saying the filters have failed....its the ability of BD to implement the filters that has failed...the current problem is spam that google DIDDDDD have a handle on is flourishing because those filters dont work post BD...google can no longer indentify networks and non-organic massive inbound links from low quality pages...i know im right because they havent made any comment on this...since they only comment on non-issues this must be an issue...get it?

whitenight

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 10:55 pm on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

lol i agree with you soapy! Take a breath.. :)

----------

I'm also seeing a particularly well-executed cloaking/re-direct site ranking for 1000s of moderate to highly competitive money words for the past month or so.

So BD can't filter that junk as well. And we all know how well spam reports work :rollseyes:

whitenight

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 5+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 2:36 am on Jul 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

I'm also seeing a particularly well-executed cloaking/re-direct site ranking for 1000s of moderate to highly competitive money words for the past month or so

SpOOky! Nothing after a month or so of spam reports , but a few hours after posting on this forum and the domain is now gone.

Should I thank them or should they thank me? :P

Lorel

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 2:53 am on Jul 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

Whenever I find one of those scammers/scrapers/jackers I report them to Google SPam, Google AdSense if they have them and Yahoo Publisher if they use them. I also read the AdSense Policy and Yahoo Publisher Policy and quote their rules that are being broken.

I can go back in a week and do the same search in Google (inurl, intitle), or check rank with Nichebot (that brings up sites with the affected site's url in the title) and that scraper site no longer comes up and the victim site has regained their rightful rank for the affected keywords. The scraper site still has the scraped data on their site but Google is no longer allowing them to rank for those keywords.

So I do believe Google takes action from the Spam, et. al reports, but not necessarily in a way that we can easily determine.

soapystar

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 7:48 am on Jul 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

Lorel

thats interesting. Are you saying you do see action but only on adsense sites or that you only report adsense sites? Are you using the spam url and do you give your webmasterworld nick? Are these no-name sites or major players?

HuhuFruFru

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 8:00 am on Jul 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

Another way if Google does not react is maybe to complain to the hosting company. I have did that and it seems they will shut down the spammer I am talking about on Monday. See here:
[webmasterworld.com...]

Lorel

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 4:05 pm on Jul 10, 2006 (gmt 0)

Soapy,

thats interesting. Are you saying you do see action but only on adsense sites or that you only report adsense sites? Are you using the spam url and do you give your webmasterworld nick? Are these no-name sites or major players?

I only report to AdSense when they are using AdSence. I can't say I get the same response from the Google Spam Report. No I don't give my Webmasterworld nick as I haven't seen where we should except in special cases. And I'm not sure if they are small scrapers or large. How does one determine that?

Huhufrufru,


Another way if Google does not react is maybe to complain to the hosting company. I have did that and it seems they will shut down the spammer I am talking about on Monday. See here:
[webmasterworld.com...]

I do that also if it's a 302 redirect on the link or they have copied a lot of copyrighted data. The hosts are usually pretty quick to remove the site especially when you point out they do it to everyone they post on their site. A few insist on a DMCA report.

Lorel

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 35056 posted 7:19 pm on Jul 10, 2006 (gmt 0)

I just found a new way to detect spammers/scraper/jackers using AdSense who link to your site in devious and possibly harmful ways.

Search for links to a specific page on your website (use Google and also check with Yahoo as Google doesn't list them all) and look for AdSense sites with weird code on them , i..e, they load the AdSense with JavaScript and control all the links on their site (to my and other sites) with what I assume is a JavaScript redirect--or some other means I couldn't detect, so when you run your mouse over them the links don' t show up in the bar at bottom of the browser but they do show up in the link command on Yahoo at least.

I only did this with 2 pages of mine and found strange links to both of my pages.

The main common denominator was that their menu links all went to a page with one picture with AdSense ads on it (an adult pic) with lots of space under it (so it looks like that is the only item on the page) and then there is more text and links way down at the bottom of the page where your/my link appears.

On the one site I couldn't tell what kind of link was pointed at my site and I couldn't copy the link to my site either to see if it's a 302 redirect as they had the option to copy turned off and I couldn't see it in bar at bottom of page so I assume it's probably a javascript redirect.

I then copied the link to that page and tried another browser to see if it was just my browser that wouldn't allow copying the link and it went instead to what I assume was a doorway page with more AdSense ads on it so they have some kind of cookie set up so you can't view this page twice.

The other site had only one character in the domain and it wasn't english so I couldn't copy it into the letter to Google AdSense. I gave Google the URL for the search in Yahoo so they could get to it otherwise I couldn't tell them where the site was.

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