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This 246 message thread spans 9 pages: < < 246 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 [9]     
The 301 Club
301 permanent redirect's & Google
modemmike




msg:712615
 9:08 pm on Sep 8, 2005 (gmt 0)

With so much conjecture about 301 redirects I thought it would be nice to discuss experiences others have had and to also explore possible consequences when using a 301 redirect. Letís try to explore alternative redirects and what might help one make a smooth transition if there is such a thing. I realize that this topic has been discussed already in some detail throughout these forums but maybe this thread can serve as a clearing house of the various ideas, theories and myths related to 301 redirects. Iím not speaking of the www vs. non-www redirects but, rather a whole domain redirect for the purposes of rebranding, avoiding copyright issues or any other practical reasons for changing a domain name.

Here is my experience with a recent 301 redirect:

--Popular travel niche website approx 4 years old.
--Actively covering all topics related to my niche but we also sell entire vacationsÖ think of this site as being a vortal covering everything and anything dealing with this niche including up-to-date news, weather, unique articles, forums, interactive tools for planning a vacation and a bunch more all of which are free.
--Very little link trading with the bulk of links coming in naturally
--Very little outbound linking
--Clean HTML (for the most part)
--Some JavaScript but nothing black hat or meant for SEO
--Listed in DMOZ, Yahoo Directory, Zeal and Google Directory
--Was a PR 4 with about 50 inbound links
--Index count was 6,080
--Was in the top 10 results pretty solid even through Bourbon and other various updates

The 301 bomb (website suicide), applied a domain wide 301 redirect via IIS to a domain that is 18 months old. E.G. olddomain.com/widgets --> newdomain.com/widgets
I have seen some people post ďwhy would you do this?Ē Ö this isnít a valid question in my opinion because there are lots of very good reasons to do so.

--301 was put in place roughly 80 days ago
--After approx 5 days the site was nowhere to be found in the SERPís
--Sent a request to help@ and was told the site was not banned or penalized
--Started the long waiting process
--Quasay non existent update Gilligan started
--Old domain was stripped of PR across all DCís
--New domain still has no PR on any DCís
--BLís update to 138 on most DCís
--Google Directory updated showing the new domain as a PR 6 and at the top of my niche
--site:oldsite.com would reveal the new domain
--index count is fluxing between 10,300 and 10,900
--PR begins to return to the old domain!
--alas, no where in the SERPís even after going 50 pages deep.

Sounds like classic sandbox in my opinion but I think a better name would be ďGilliganís IslandĒ because most of us in 301 club feel stranded on a deserted island with no hope of rescue but occasionally there is a glimmer of hope on the horizon.

I also want to point out that until you have been through an experience like this itís not helping anyone to call people in this situation whiners, or something inflammatory because we are simply trying to figure out how to make a some what smooth transition and to avoid the sandbox.

Well, if you are still reading you are probably in this position now but if you are thinking about doing a 301 redirect, do so understanding that you will loss rank for at least several weeks.

Here some alternatives that have been discussed

1)Meta refresh to new domain Ė bad, could get a dupe content filter
2)JavaScript redirect Ė bad, looks too black hat or spammy
3)302 redirect Ė is not permanent and is also very spammy looking
4)404 all old pages Ė donít know how this would work
5)Build a new site which simply wasnít an option for me because I have a lot of unique content that would take weeks to regenerate without having any duplication

Another way to look at this was put best by jd01
It appears...
New Domain with 301 from old site = New Site
New Domain with no redirect from old site = New Site
New Domain with meta refresh from old site = New Site
New Domain and old domain with old content = New Site & Dup Content
IOW New Domain = New Site
Don't change if you don't have to - the, for lack of a better term, sandbox is in play.
Justin

I have searched high and wide looking for success stories and only found a few where as horror stories are the norm.

Being that GoogleGuy is the closest thing we have to a direct contact (for most of us anyway) I would greatly appreciate his feedback.

 

icarus




msg:712855
 1:38 am on Dec 12, 2005 (gmt 0)

g1smd

How I missed that part of your last advice is beyond me :). Thanks.

claus




msg:712856
 2:18 am on Dec 12, 2005 (gmt 0)

Just being curious here, Jagger over or not:

So, how's life in "the 301 club" these days? Same as ever, or worse than ever?

- Any improvement at all?

Let's get a post-Jagger status, if anyone's got hope left or anything to tell.

bether2




msg:712857
 5:27 pm on Dec 12, 2005 (gmt 0)

G1smd said:
bether2: It seems that IIS/5.0 gives out "301 Error" whilst IIS/6.0 gives out "301 Moved Permanently". Can anyone else confirm this? I only ever use Apache servers.

Can anyone help me on this? :)

icarus




msg:712858
 3:08 am on Dec 21, 2005 (gmt 0)

Just a brief update:

After 1.5 months since implementing http:// to [www...] 301 redirect:

link:site.com
is now matching
link:www.site.com numbers.

Up until 24 hours ago, link:site.com was returning 0, which it had been doing since 3 days after the 301 was put in place.

There's also been an increase in the backlink count.

site:www.site.com still shows the home page buried at around position 100, which it has been since soon after the 301 was added.

General G rankings and G traffic are still way down on prior to the 301 implementation (down about 75%).

Still showing PR6 in toolbar and G directory. We also appear to have climbed up a notch in the directory in the last day or so. Y! and MSN traffic unaffected, Y! rankings and traffic have actually improved a little.

oodlum




msg:712859
 2:50 pm on Dec 21, 2005 (gmt 0)

A question for those here that have successfully transferred PR from one page to another via a 301 redirect. Did you have to wait for the next PR update to see the visible PR transferred, or should it show up in between updates?

Thanks.

g1smd




msg:712860
 3:11 pm on Dec 21, 2005 (gmt 0)

Had to wait one to three months for it to show on Toolbar - however we all know that Toolbar PR lags "real PR" by several months anyway.

When the new URL is fully indexed (showing both a title and description) and the old URL has at least turned URL-only then the job is all but done. PR isn't a problem.

This 246 message thread spans 9 pages: < < 246 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 [9]
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