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Google Update Bourbon Part 4
GoogleGuy




msg:736898
 12:02 am on Jun 4, 2005 (gmt 0)

Continued from part 3 here: [webmasterworld.com...]


I did the rounds to check on the state of various data updates. I'd estimate that the "0.5" (not algorithmic changes, but rather responses to various spam/porn complaints + processing reinclusion requests) should go out this weekend sometime or possibly Monday. There should be a binary push this week to improve a corner-case of CJK-related search, and that new binary should have the hooks to turn on the third set of data. Regarding finishing up the second piece of data, there's still two data centers with older data. Those data centers will probably be switched over by Monday. By Monday, 2.5 of the 3.5 things will probably be on.

 

walkman




msg:737678
 8:02 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

followgreg,
I am not gonna follow you. "Danny" is not the one I think you're talking about, this "danny" has a book review site, nto a SE related site.

Whether one relies on SEs 100%, 50% or 0%, it's totally irrelevant; we're talking about why some sites aren't ranked on the most widely used SE. If it was a business plan thread, I'd agree with you.

>> did all of you check your allinanchor results? Competition grow and being on top of SE may not be forever.

yeah, that's it. Competition grew so much within a month that many sites went from top 5 to 100+ in the serps.

Dayo_UK




msg:737679
 8:10 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

>>If it was a business plan thread, I'd agree with you.

I would to a degree too. But a business plan can have that as a factor like any other variable.

Say the variable was shoppers coming down a high street - therefore you build your shop! - It is like G has suddenly put a road is closed sign down your street and deleted your entry from the Yellow Pages.

Business Plan based on shoppers coming down a high street to a shop. Never!

OK, you may have an argument if a shop next door had opened selling better, cheaper products etc but you should at least still be found. (Especially if someone wants to find you! - eg Company Name etc.)

OK OK - Google owes us nothing - but neither does the govt if they suddenly decide to close a road. (actually taking the govt examples - it is like anyone has put a road block sign up when the road is not blocked directing you to another street and the govt/local auth doing nothing about it - eg Hijack)

I dont know ramble ramble (to tired, confused etc) - wont argue back if anyone wants to contradict - much to tired.

Let us hope it is just roadworks rather than a road is closed sign. :)

lorenzinho2 - will prob sticky you tomorrow - oops tomorrow is saturday - might go to the coast to get away from it all

reseller




msg:737680
 8:42 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

DAYO_UK

> oops tomorrow is saturday - might go to the coast to get away from it all <

Well... you deserve a little break away from Google, the DCs and those sites that we all hope to see them return to you save and sound ;-).

Dayo_UK




msg:737681
 8:44 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

reseller

Where have you been today?

Your site holding up.

I am just sooo confused.

Luxuryhousingtrends




msg:737682
 8:46 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

But what is a "Clint-style" site? I must have missed seeing Clint's site.

All I can think of is Neal Stephenson's Snow Crash. IIRC "Clints" were the generic avatars people used for accessing Metaspace.

Dayo_UK




msg:737683
 8:47 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

Clint is famous now though :)

As famous as the Sandbox.

In years to come we will all me referring to Clint Type/Style sites :)

Sorry GG - just being silly remember - not having a go - got to keep a sense of humour :)

Dayo_UK




msg:737684
 8:51 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

The Year is 2056:-

GoogleOAP - Do you remember Clint Type Sites.

Dayo_(formerly_UK_now_EU) - Aha - do you mean non-www www problems or not

reseller (formerly_denmark_now_new_viking_alliance) - Has the fat lady sung yet ;)

reseller




msg:737685
 8:52 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

DAYO_UK

Was little busy but kept an eye on the thread through the day.

My site hasnīt been much affected by Bourbon, and traffic today as low as any friday. However I see Google sending more targeted referrals who are also AdSense happy people ;-)

Canīt make anything out of the DCs. Still see several sets.

Whats the latest weather report of your sites?

Dayo_UK




msg:737686
 8:54 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

Weather report is uncertain - followed by a period of uncertainty.

Dayo_UK




msg:737687
 8:59 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

GG - Thanks for that post in your thread regarding reinclusion requests - could be useful for me - and others of course :).

activeco




msg:737688
 9:28 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

OK, even if the changes were settled down and the results are back to reasonable (?), it took so much time that, if this happens only once a year, we can count on weird stuff for 1/4 of the year.
Does it seem OK?

reseller




msg:737689
 9:29 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

Dayo_UK

>GG - Thanks for that post in your thread regarding reinclusion requests - could be useful for me - and others of course :)<

Yes very kind of GG. And I see that he wrote this time in a style that doesnīt need decoding ;-)

Dayo_UK




msg:737690
 9:34 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

>>>Yes very kind of GG. And I see that he wrote this time in a style that doesnīt need decoding ;-)

:) - You have to appreciate what he does here though. I certainly could not stand the amount of rubbish that is thrown his way.

I Got really annoyed the other day with some chav who did not know anything.

Amazed he can keep so cool.

OK enough brown nosing - any sign of canonical url fix GG? ;) - sigh

ltedesco




msg:737691
 9:39 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

Dayo_UK
>GG - Thanks for that post in your thread regarding reinclusion requests - could be useful for me - and others of course :)<

Yes very kind of GG. And I see that he wrote this time in a style that doesnīt need decoding ;-)

Where is it? I missed that :o(

Dayo_UK




msg:737692
 9:41 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

ltedesco

With ref to your post the other night - look into doing a 301 redirect.

With ref to GG posts - here we go:- (again pay close attention to post 7)

[webmasterworld.com...]

ltedesco




msg:737693
 9:46 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

Thanks Dayo_UK

Dayo_UK




msg:737694
 9:47 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

No probs.

Trying to help people. Hope it works out.

Look at the apache forum if you need any help with 301 redirects - it has been covered a million and one times recently (for some reason ;))

confused ellie




msg:737695
 9:57 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

For a reinclusion request, does anyone know if there is somewhere that we have to go to do this? Do we just go to the standard help area of Google? I found the Contact Us form but wasn't quite sure if that was exactly where we should send in reinclusion requests.

Also, does anyone know if you ask for a reinclusion do you have to have vanished completely from the results or is a 300+ drop good enough.

We did some major cleaning of our site and I am not sure if we should request reinclusion since we have dropped so badly during this update. I am also concerned that if you request reinclusion, will that mean you start from scratch and loose all your PR?

If anyone has any ideas, please let me know.

Ellie

Dayo_UK




msg:737696
 10:00 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

Confused Ellie

Here you go:-

[google.com...]

However - As I have seen your site Google may say there is not a penalty.

Hope that Helps - err - dont know how.

Confused Dayo_UK

confused ellie




msg:737697
 10:05 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

If we have no penalty then I can't figure what else is wrong. :( We discovered many dup pages because of testing when we were building things. Found a few links that still lead to those pages by accident so we had to do quite a bit of clean up in hopes that Gbot can get rid of the mess. I was thinking maybe we would have a dup content penalty against us. If not though, I guess Gbot just doesn't like us anymore. Very sad. :S

That is terribly discouraging.

Thanks for the link. Much appreciated.

Ellie

Dayo_UK




msg:737698
 10:07 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

Ellie

Sorry - dont want to discourage you.

Try the link and see what happens. Hopefully the other thing I suggested by sticky a few days ago may help in time.

Dayo_UK

Night night folks - trying to help people - but very confused now

confused ellie




msg:737699
 10:13 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

I would almost prefer that we had done something wrong that we could fix than Gbot just now hating our site. It's a shame, we worked hard on it. It's just as good as any of our competitors. So sad.

Thanks for those suggestions Dayo... We worked on them immediately.

Ellie

[edited by: confused_ellie at 10:17 pm (utc) on June 10, 2005]

reseller




msg:737700
 10:14 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

Dayo_UK

>Night night folks - trying to help people - but very confused now <

Sleep well. You are a great help for sure. Thanks.

sailorjwd




msg:737701
 10:30 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

I dusted off my Business Disaster Recovery Plan today.

Opened the chapter on 'You Have No Website'

All I could find was a statement that said:

'Bend over and kiss your sweet business goodbye'

followgreg




msg:737702
 11:28 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)


Just to follow up with my previous posts :)

No need to shoot me like this, I feel for you and I guess that if I was relying on search engines to live I'd be mad at Google for droping my site.
It's of course ridiculous not to appear on top of the SERP for your own unique business name (unless penalty)

At the same time, when i'm searching for something online right now: the results I get are not more irrelevant than before the update AT ALL.

HostingDirectory




msg:737703
 11:53 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

At the same time, when i'm searching for something online right now: the results I get are not more irrelevant than before the update AT ALL.

You are joking right? Have you not noticed that only around 3-4 websites on the first page are the quality ones - then the rest are low quality, going to page 2 starts to reveal odd websites appearing - not relevant at all.. past page 3... suddenly its all yahoo directory listings, google directory listings... some porn sites thrown in for good measure and the odd geocities site with the keyword appearing in an odd - out of context sentence... all the relavant sites now appear around 300-10,000 ...

hmmmmmmmmm ... yeah Bourbon is a great improvement.

This problem seems more widescale on certain sectors, while others seem much the same. Maybe they pulled the update before it damaged the whole index?
The results are still better than MSN... not better than before Google updated... and on many sectors that have been hit.. id say that Yahoo is clearly ahead of the pack.

Don't get me wrong, iv'e loved Google for many years which makes it so sad to see it go backwords like this, i never thought that this kind of thing would happen to Google - they have been way ahead of the competition for so long.

I am hoping that they fix the problem but with it lasting so long, i am starting to wonder that maybe they can't fix it. I would have thought they would have backed up to before Bourbon and worked on the problem.

Going to the backup would have been the best action to take.

danny




msg:737704
 11:54 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

If the "danny" here is the one i'm thinking, may be selling text links to totally unrelated websites is not the best

That's a different Danny. Check my profile site if you want to know who I am, but I'm certainly not selling text links.

subbu




msg:737705
 12:08 am on Jun 11, 2005 (gmt 0)

HostingDirectory:
Have you not noticed that only around 3-4 websites on the first page are the quality ones - then the rest are low quality, going to page 2 starts to reveal odd websites appearing - not relevant at all.. past page 3... suddenly its all yahoo directory listings, google directory listings... some porn sites thrown in for good measure and the odd geocities site with the keyword appearing in an odd - out of context sentence... all the relavant sites now appear around 300-10,000 ...

I must disagree.

That's certainly not the case in my niche. For a specific KW pair that has HUGE potential to be filled with spam/ porn, results that have been returned for the first ten SERPs are OUTSTANDING. There is one single Yahoo Directory page among these results, somewhere around 60-80.

S.

fearlessrick




msg:737706
 12:21 am on Jun 11, 2005 (gmt 0)

Well, that's it for another week. After thinking it couldn't get worse - for me - after two weeks with a 70% drop in traffic, it did. My site fell further in the SERPs.

I believe that most of the problems I and others are experiencing are due to scrapers, hijackers and thieves and Google's unwillingness or inability to do anything about it. (truth of the matter is that Google could fix everything by banning about 100-200,000 scraper sites from Adsense)

So, I'm bck to where I was nine or ten days ago, when I was having my posts pulled for being off-topic for saying that webmasters needed to develop other sources for traffic, away from Google.

So much for Google. I can neither rely on them for income nor trust them going forward for anything.

Very disappointed that while Google has been able to produce record profits and revenues for Wall Street, they cannot produce 30 days worth of consistent revenue for a site. Is anybody out there COMPLETELY satified with AdSense revenue? That you find it stable, reliable, predictable, as it would be in a real business environment?

OUT.

HostingDirectory




msg:737707
 12:29 am on Jun 11, 2005 (gmt 0)

I must disagree.

That's certainly not the case in my niche. For a specific KW pair that has HUGE potential to be filled with spam/ porn, results that have been returned for the first ten SERPs are OUTSTANDING. There is one single Yahoo Directory page among these results, somewhere around 60-80.

I promise i am not saying this because my site got whacked... strangely some of my listings are beginning to return - so maybe they are starting to fix the problem, atleast for sites they should not be penalised.

I can't post examples here since it is aganst the rules, but if you sticky me i can show you some searches to do at Google - proving what i say is correct.

If i do this, atleast come back here and admit there is a problem with certain sectors - that were not there before Bourbon.. agreed?

flicker




msg:737708
 12:42 am on Jun 11, 2005 (gmt 0)

>You are joking right? Have you not noticed
>that only around 3-4 websites on the first
>page are the quality ones - then the rest are
>low quality, going to page 2 starts to reveal
>odd websites appearing - not relevant at all..
>past page 3... suddenly its all yahoo directory >listings, google directory listings... some porn
>sites thrown in for good measure and the odd
>geocities site with the keyword appearing in
>an odd - out of context sentence... all the
>relavant sites now appear around 300-10,000 ...

It totally depends on what kind of search you do. For the search terms I'm most familiar with, I literally didn't notice there was an update till I stumbled across these giganto-threads. Right now, educational searches I'm trying out are looking better than ever; VERY high-quality results and palpably better than they were a year ago. Other searches look good except that individual quality sites seem to have inexplicably gone missing. Other searches look like complete and total garbage.

My guess is different topics and sectors meet with spammers of different persuasions and skills, so it must be easier to get some SERPs right than others. I also suspect the update's still not completely over and there may be more useful data that's going to chime in before all's said and done.

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