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This 273 message thread spans 10 pages: < < 273 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 [8] 9 10 > >     
November 2002 Google Update

 5:09 am on Nov 28, 2002 (gmt 0)

Did I announce it first?



 12:50 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

Anyone seen the deepcrawl bot around yet?


 12:56 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

Happy Thanksgiving everyone!

The things that I liked about radiosky and europeforvisitor's (and Brett's) posts is that they stress getting back to basics: adding good content and making a good site architecture with search-engine friendly pages that are easy to crawl.

Exactly. If it works well for the visitors, chances are it will work well for the search engines.


 1:43 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

What a tease: just checked and was at 4 for main keyword, up from 26. really thought i must be doing something right. - 5 mins later, however, i'm back to 26. HUGE let down. Decided to go cry in my beer only to find out fridge is empty! Not my day.


 1:56 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

Oooh, Oooh, Oooh! She's definitely still dancing folks. On one key SERP, while at the beginning of the dance I was still stuck at #8, on one of the datacenters that site of mine jumped just jumped to #3. Definitely things are still in flux. I've also nudged up a bit on a couple other SERPs. Personally, I know better than to count my chickens before they are hatched. On one dance early on I was #1 for the most important SERP. At the end of the dance I dropped to #3, and since then have fallen to no better than #6 on that SERP. However, I can hope, right? ;) Based on watching a number of dances, my belief is that new Pagerank doesn't fully get factored in to the end. Both my sites are relatively new (the oldest is just 9 months old), and have been building up more incoming links I have managed to get. Thus I expect that my site's PR is gradually increasing. If my theory is right, since all the other sites are far more mature and links aren't increasing as much, I would expect some gains. I'm convinced the fat lady hasn't sung yet. I just hope she sings my tune. ;)


 2:08 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

>What a tease: just checked and was at 4 for main keyword, up from 26. really thought i must be doing something right. - 5 mins later, however, i'm back to 26. HUGE let down. Decided to go cry in my beer only to find out fridge is empty! Not my day.

Expect to end up #26. That way, no chance you'll be disappointed. ;)


 2:21 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

>>"Most people who work at Google seem to love having lots of hard drives. Mmmm, vast quantities of storage.. "

IMHO, I think he just gave you one of his subtle hints he is semi-famous for.


 2:40 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

Just got a second place in a two-word query with 1.8M results.

The first word of the query is only present in the alt on one of the images. Nowhere else on the page. I didn't even think about this word when I created that alt, it was just a fair description of the image.

I was really surprised when I started getting referrals from that query.



 3:06 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

egomaniac, I found a similar situation... pages that I added after the deep crawl are ranking in www2 and www3.

Wild speculation here: But while they are ranking, I don't think they are ranking very well. I'm guessing they aren't getting any PR benefit. They show, and will rank right at the top for specific queries, but I am sure one page I have (that was added two weeks ago) will rank in the top three for a query next month where it is only #11 now in www2 and www3 (and #13 in www from freshbot).


 3:16 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

oh gawd, not agaaain! I have no back links and no relateds - but, very weird, I still have a PR5. Have checked w2, w3, w-ex. Same for www when it's showing new db.

I didn't change anything this month except some titles and general content stuff plus added several new pages of content, not products. I wouldn't think this could possibly effect back links. I also added three new link-outs, but they are (still) PR5 sites - even their link pages.

Question - Have fresh dates shown up in w2 and w3 before?


 3:26 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

>>Question - Have fresh dates shown up in w2 and w3 before?

I'm sure I've seen them on a regular basis for awhile now. I don't remember for how long though...


 4:00 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

this might be a new thread, but since www2 & www3 is mentioned a bit here...

i''ve read threads that say if your site ranks, for example, #4 in w2 and w3, then when W settles down, you won't fall much lower. Well, I've experienced #4 during an update and then fell to #31 after things were settled.

Does this mean that PR is factored in at the last minute before all is settled and my PR slammed me? My toolbar gives me PR.

Any thoughts?

Hope it doesn't happen again this time as www2 and www3 look great for me! -but it looked good last time too and I fell big time :(


 4:01 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

Oops! Accidentally deleted my PR... it's PR4 on the toolbar.


 4:02 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

i just checked and my index page shows a fresh date of Nov 28 on ww3. This is only my second "dance" and the everflux is something I'm beginning to grasp. Just wondering how long on average until WWW(1) gets finally updated. I've noticed as others have that Yahoo shows the new update so I can only assume it will be soon.


 4:11 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

i must be a dolt - yahoo for my keywords don't reflect www2 or www3 info - is this what everyone means by "yahoo is reflecting the changes"? if not, what do you mean?


 4:11 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

i read in another thread that it can take up to 7 days to settle down...


 4:59 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

It seems to be the same algo as last month, which is just fine, I hate change ;)

Visit Thailand

 5:07 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

needhelp - they mean on google so www.google.com and www2.google.com etc

As yahoo uses googles search results some people look at that to see whether the update is close to finishing (i.e results on yahoo same as on google).

- anyway I cannot see any changes anywhere for anything! and I have been seeing 632,000 b/links for yahoo on .com, 2 +3. Maybe it is just my computer.

BTW how are all you guys checking this? As according to the new SEO etc guidelines using tools such as google-dance is not good and is against their TOS, or something.


 6:06 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

visit-Thailand. I read google's guidelines as warning against "automated" or robot-driven querying of their database. These types of programs are mostly the programmatic position checkers which run off a desktop program or a automated script and are capable of say hundreds or thousands of hits an hour.

Using those tools manually are not a violation of this as I read it and if you are on a dial up, there is no way Google would know what sites you are checking anyway, unless maybe you are a tool bar user and they know the sites you go to all the time... But that's bordering on the paranoid..

I really dont think checking a dozen terms every so often a month using one of those online dance checkers would cause any strain on their servers. Their problem is the stuff that can do things much faster than humans can.


 6:37 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

Tuesday comes the big calm... and Everflux takes over in frenzy...

Visit Thailand

 6:42 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

Chiyo, think you are right but is strange I cannot see any change doing it manually normally I can. Anyway as I am half paranoid I'll use an internet cafe to check my and my closest competitors site on google-dance!...just in case...


 7:33 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

One site we just launched went like this

Month 1 - Nothing
Month 2 - PR 4
Month 3 - PR 5

Still working out well, waiting for DMOZ addition, but the site is listed in Yahoo.


 9:55 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

I have been checking from the UK on my site and the only changes I've noticed in rankings are very slightly down but mainly the same. I have made lots of changes and had many links added but they don't seem to have been picked up. Do you think I have been missed or are the results not showing yet?


 10:11 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

Sigh .... here's an update on my sites that were down when my host had ... well .. hosting problems for a few days.
1 site fine - no change.
2nd site - It was a new one, and while none of the dynamic pages were picked up, a couple of the static ones were, giving me hope.
3rd site - Toast.
PR4 to PR0 in less time than it took to go to a friends house for dinner. What really annoys me is that this site was a PR0, mainly due to it being my first domain and me not having a clue what to do - or how to do it for a few years. It hadn't been touched in probably 2 years. It took several months but I got it up to the PR4 and started getting some decent uniques and views, enough to warrant putting some more time into it. Arrgh.

Thanks to those who offered some referrals for good hosts, as soon as I can afford it I am transferring away from these froons. May as well save the ones that are left.

If you will excuse me, I have to go now and delicately place my head in my toilet bowl and flush till the hurting stops.

Tropical Island

 10:56 am on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

There is still a ways to go. The site that was missed last month is back in however we are still not showing any PR (grey bar) on the main page even though it is 3rd for it's main search term.


 12:52 pm on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)


Thank you to everyone at Webmasterworld. Thanks for answering daft questions (mine and other users). I really don't understand half of what is talked about here, but the bits I have picked up have now got us much higher than we anticipated. PR this month has gone up to 5 and we are now 3rd in our very competitive category in the Google directory.

Of particular use were Bretts 12 month strategy....and we've only been going for 4 months...

As a new user I found all the tips and tricks and hints at SEW very useful, and the Google Knowledge Base was the first thing I found on this site, and couldn't believe I'd found such a goldmine! I am a complete amateur webmaster, but I feel I know enough now to offer to improve other peoples sites.

It just seems to boil down to this :

To rank well with Google, put the words on the page that you want people to look for. Don't spam. Get lots of relevant links. Keep your site simple and user friendly. No pop ups, flashy things, music, tiny text etcc.. CHECK YOUR REFERRAL LOGS. Even if they are not accurate, they give you an idea of where traffic comes from, what keywords are being used to hit your site, and where you can improve.

3 months ago, I made a big list of all keywords/keyword phrases I could think of and searched Google with all of them to find our ranking. It identified very quickly what words or phrases we needed to improve on. So I wrote some new pages to try and target different searches, and altered titles of others. Then, put in the oven for a month and wait for results. Sometimes it takes a while for the crawl, update, crawl, update cycle to catch your new content, so I learned to be patient. Right now is time to write new pages that will not be updated until January 2003.

It seems that it's not so difficult. This site has the answers mixed with a lot of speculation (like "who is googleguy?", "how does PR really work?", "what is the algo?")

I have enjoyed learning some tricks here and will continue to enjoy it. Viva Google and Viva Webmasterworld!


 2:47 pm on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

"3rd site - Toast" - podawd: what a nightmare. after your story i've stopped feeling sorry for myself. hope something positive happens before this settles.

apropos of flux, is this normal? google searches for main keyword dramatically alternate results from second to second. e.g.: "my widgets" shows up #3 out of 44,000 results, however, 1 second later it's, "my widgets" at #25 out of 22,000 results, then back again. is anyone else seeing this degree of flux?

Made In Sheffield

 5:05 pm on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

Yes it's definately still switching betwen 2 result sets for my keywords.

I keep switching between PR0 and PR4 (first time in index).


 5:20 pm on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

That's right, it's not over is it?
Normally PR fluctuates until the whole thing is over when it then settles. Is there a chance my PR may not stay at 0? I have seen fluctuation on some other sites still, but on this one it has been PR0 consitently since it happened last night, and lordy have I been checking.
Or at this point is that just wishful thinking?

Tropical Island

 5:24 pm on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

Our site is now showing a PR 5 after showing a grey bar for the last month. WWW has reverted to old index. Still lots going on.


 6:30 pm on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

OK, confused newbie alert, forgive me if you've read these paraniod ramblings a million times before.

My site went live mid-October, was deep-crawled early November and has since then been in and out of Google (I assume thanks to freshbot), all the time with a grey pr.

It was out the last week or so and when it came back in just as the dance started and my pr went from grey to 0 I got excited thinking I was about to get permanently listed. I was in on www for a few keywords but not when entering my domain directly. I wasn't in at all on www2 and www3, which worries me.

But no joy, I am out again completely now and my pr fluctuates between grey and pr0 at random.

What does this scenario suggest? I added some quality backlinks over the last few weeks but too late for the Nov crawl - have I missed the boat this time?


 7:26 pm on Nov 30, 2002 (gmt 0)

Just checked again and I'm now listed when I do allinurl:www.mydomin.com on google.com and www2 and www3, (although it's my old page that was crawled early Nov).

Does this mean I'm likely to be permanently in when the dance settles down (and when will that be?).

This 273 message thread spans 10 pages: < < 273 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 [8] 9 10 > >
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