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traffic from google has dropped
dhaliwal




msg:203576
 5:51 pm on Aug 6, 2004 (gmt 0)

anyone seen the drop in traffic from google?
I am seeing that the traffic has dropped nearly 50 % in a day while the pages in index are the same and also the SERP have not changed that way.

I am talking about traffic of nearly 7 k from google everyday and hence its a sizable decrease.

Looking for early answers on how we could check the things

 

div01




msg:203696
 2:41 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

2) is a possibility though I am not done with my analysis.

3) Yes, I have atleast one site with DMOZ links, including several deeplinks, that seems to be suffering. DMOZ links haven't been of much help to my other sites that seem to be in extended sandbox/limbo mode but that is another thread.

europeforvisitors




msg:203697
 3:38 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

Does anyone have a site they can compare to with this time last year? One that is stable and changes very little in the SERPS to compare to?

I do, and Google referrals have increased both in real numbers and as a percentage of total referrals. If Google is losing market share, the evidence has yet to show up in my referrer data.

dhaliwal




msg:203698
 4:53 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

i only wish that this update is rolled back. I don't see the good search pages coming in for some of the keywords.

for a travel site, the yahoo is now showing two top links from catholic education site and a NGO that works in health.

How could they be better for travel tips, and i have seen absurd results for many search keywords realted to my travel site.

diamondgrl




msg:203699
 5:00 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

guys, check out this thread:

[webmasterworld.com...]

if google is dropping in market share, you should also see a broad dropoff in adwords traffic at the very same time. this is, in fact, happening to at least one person.

i am far from concluding that google has dropped like a rock, since that seems to be far less likely than an algo change diverting traffic to other sites, but this is an interesting post.

[edited by: DaveAtIFG at 9:26 pm (utc) on Aug. 8, 2004]
[edit reason] Linked URL. We can link to ourselves anytime! :-) [/edit]

Lorel




msg:203700
 5:17 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)


Does anyone have a site they can compare to with this time last year? One that is stable and changes very little in the SERPS to compare to?

My site has been online since 2000--about 40 pages. It has made steady progress in last 4 years and does not drop during summer.

Last Dec I started updating several of my pages every week and my visitors doubled and increased weekly. I have had over 90% visitors from Google for several months now and they have been increasing weekly.

However my visitors did drop this last week by 10% and I can't tell what might be the cause because major keywords seem to be still ok and same referrals are still showing up.

So, in my case it's not an August slump.

shri




msg:203701
 5:17 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

Market changes don't happen this quickly. Sorry.. but traffic patterns across the board are showing several drops over the last week for many members. 50% of my visitors have not changed their minds about Google over the last week.

A quick check over a stable keyword has shown rankings from across various datacenters

8 to 30 (original was 2)

8 on 66.102.9.99 out of 1,370,000
30 on 216.239.39.99 out of 1,320,000

On a less competitive phrase (main phrase for site 2)

1 on 66.102.9.99 out of 34,300
1 on 216.239.39.99 out of 33,800

Also noticing that a number of datacenters are offline. Results on 216.239.39.99 seem fresher ....

<added: bah .. results are changing on the individual datacenters also ..>

shanbr




msg:203702
 5:47 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

I know that some of your say that it is just google traffice, i also know that some of you say watch the stock chart, others say it is another Florida etc.

I personally do not think so.

Has anyone gone through their keywords and checked your rankings?

Google has dropped all our sites instantly within 2 days time from all major keywords.

We do "everything" like their legal document states from the way they link etc. which hurts knowing that some sites beat our rankings in Google and they do "not" go by the rules.

Like yesterday, I went shopping for some stuff and found a coupon site listed high called flamingoworld.com, went into the page for the store I wanted and they spammed "coupons" about 50 times on one little coupon page and only had 3 offers.

I don't understand what Google is doing, but if they keep doing this to those who list in their search engine, that will be thousands of users that they are also shoving into other search engines.

We held our top spots for years in the search engines always keeping on top of the latest linking methods etc. I just don't understand what they are doing now.

We are a two many run network and this is what pays our bills, or what did pay our bills. We live in the middle of nowhere and the only job here is pizza delivery, not something we are looking forward to going back too. Just hope they fix things right away.

vanderbolt




msg:203703
 5:53 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

A small observation: From my vantage, it seems that keywords in domain names are really kicking butt. Anyone see this too?

lorenzinho2




msg:203704
 5:55 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

< One site received much of its traffic based on an extremely broad range of keywords that covered a lot of different combinations. It seems that the traffic for those thousands of combos went down dramatically while the traffic for a few of the targeted keyword phrases/pages (external links pointing to those pages) have retained their rankings.

Us too. The devaluing of internal links theory is consistent with what we're seeing. Individual pages within our 200K page site are not well optimized. Historically, we have ranked well by efficiently distributing our PR throughout the site, allowing us to do very well on pages focusing on non-competitive key words.

As an added data point, after a mod rewrite several months ago, we did not 301 our dynamic urls to the new static urls. Meaning that all of our backlinks from other sites that pointed to internal pages, now point to the 'old' urls. These old URLs were filtered out of G (rightfully) as duplicate content.

Up until this week, this loss of backlinks to individual pages hadn't been a problem for us, as those backlinks were still being applied to the domain, which was in turn distributing that credit throughout the site.

If this theory holds water and the changes stick, it would seem like a nice development for the SEO community, and an unfortunate development for large, established sites who had been able to focus on building content (and not running link development campaigns).

LukeC




msg:203705
 6:25 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

My guesses so far are:

1. An "authority site" is now a site that is focused on a specific area, so a site JUST about mp3 players is an authority on mp3 players and might also rank well for google sandbox terms related to mp3 players:

cd player, mp3 music, cheap hifi etc

2. There seems to be a further increased value to well established brands that will naturally have a lot of inbound links, they are usually about a specific area and so are now an authority site, getting even better ranking then before because:

3. Inbound anchor text has even more weighting while internal anchor text (possibly completely diluted?) doesn't seem to have any... This fits in neatly with the new concept of what an authority site is because these niche sites will naturally have inbound links with appropriate anchor text.

More speculative:

I wonder though if Google are keeping a closer eye on how people get their inbound links, they hate webmasters creating value for their sites, so it could be hard to get out of this mess...

Is google reading affiliate links? I noticed one ecommerce company's backlinks including a page that ONLY had an affiliate link to it - [scripts.affiliatenetwork...] etc

I wonder if thats why some of the ecommerce sites appear to have moved up the rankings?

Look forward to people telling me I'm barking mad, the need for some answers is more important so go ahead!

Ian_Cowley




msg:203706
 7:13 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

Some of my big sites (30,000+ pages) have lost 70% - 80% of traffic in the last two days. Somethings going on here, but as yet I have to no concrete evidence as to what.

Fingers crossed it will right itself.

lars




msg:203707
 7:20 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

I follow several dozen client sites very closely. Different sectors, mostly e-commerce, some informational. All very "lightly" SEO'd, mostly accessability only. All well within the Guidelines. All single "subject" sites, i.e. selling one product, or covering one sector. Five out of 42 have dropped out of the top five for their most significant keywords, after 1 to 5 years in those positions. All survived Florida unscathed. No other particular reason that I can find for losing position. The five "drop outs" are more current than several other sites that have survived. Several sites display AdSense. None use AdWords. I'm seeing a pattern of inconsistency across various sectors, industries, keywords. A "non-pattern". Naturally, the traffic has dropped accordingly.

I believe that the majority of traffic loss reflects changes to position. This seems to be a "check your referrer logs" for keywords mandate. If position drops, obviously traffic will follow.

However, there's a high degree of inconcistency. I'm not seeing wide adjustments. Such inconsistency could be indicative of very sector/category specific tweaking of the algo. Or human audits.

If your site has dropped in your main keywords, or most competitive keywords, how likely would it be to stand up to a very detailed manual inspection? If you were required to rank your site against all others in selected keywords, where would it rank, based on its true comparative relevancy (rather than parental fondness)?

As more of an "outsider" than the site owners, I can look a bit more objectively, and say that the content of half dozen of the sites I've created professionally is not as good as other sites located under the same keywords. I don't control content, only presentation. None of those sites have been affected by a drop in postion or a loss in traffic.

But then -- I looked individually at the top 25 sites in each category (125 sites in all) where my clients site's had dropped out of top positions, and noticed something "odd" -- none -- absolutely NONE -- of the sites now on the first page (top 10) were using AdSense. Only a handful used any sort of advertising whatsoever. Somehow that strikes me as quite ... unusual.

Does anybody else see this in their own sectors?

(New) Authority = Scarcity of Affiliate and/or Sponsored Text Advertising?

[edited by: lars at 7:25 pm (utc) on Aug. 8, 2004]

shri




msg:203708
 7:24 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

>> Scarcity of Affiliate and/or Sponsored Text Advertising?

Nah .. I've seen Amazon links and google adwords show up in some pretty respectable places. :)

mikeD




msg:203709
 7:51 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

(New) Authority = Scarcity of Affiliate and/or Sponsored Text Advertising?

Yes I've noticed this and I can't understand the reasoning. A great many information / review sites relay on advertising to function. Such as PC hardware reviews sites.

Advertising is the only way Google and Yahoo function, shame they penalise others for doing the same. Be nice to hear GG comments on this thread.

bobothecat




msg:203710
 8:06 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

>> Scarcity of Affiliate and/or Sponsored Text Advertising?

Not in the Travel and Tourism industry... if anything it's gotten worse. There seems to be even more boiler-plate sites with throw-away domains ... most displaying adsense ads - hmmm....

europeforvisitors




msg:203711
 8:14 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

(New) Authority = Scarcity of Affiliate and/or Sponsored Text Advertising?

I've got affiliate links and AdSense ads on most of my 4,000 or so editorial pages, and they haven't hurt me at all.

Anyway, it wouldn't make sense for Google to take a negative view of affiliate links and text advertising, because ads and/or affiliate links support most information sites on the Web--and Google's stated corporate mission is to organize the Web's information and make it universally accessible.

mmanning




msg:203712
 8:17 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

I am a travel and tourism guy and have spent a good 2 years building up a very specific data file to help in creating something 'new' in the industry.

I am currently gone off of the landscape over the past 3 days. I had been in the top three for my specific searches. I cannot see how I can be wedged now on page 10 in the results next to completely unrelated items.

LukeC




msg:203713
 8:21 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

ok I'm noticing that searching on [google.co.uk...] and selecting "uk only" is bringing up similiar results to before this update. anyone else?

also some results are real messy and bizarre - maybe this isn't over yet?

[edited by: DaveAtIFG at 9:31 pm (utc) on Aug. 8, 2004]
[edit reason] Linked URL [/edit]

PhraSEOlogy




msg:203714
 9:02 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

I did a search on a pet keyphrase and found no adsense or affiliate links at all for the top results.

I did however find that a high ranking page had the keyphrase in the middle of the title tag and nowhere else - except in meta keywords - which was stuffed to capacity. Also they had inbounds from FFA's etc.

So it seems to me that I need to start keyword stuffing and getting more FFA links to get a decent ranking.

xcomm




msg:203715
 9:13 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

no adsense or affiliate links at all for the top results

Maybe you should think about it this way:

The Adsense program is the perfect way to meassure the success of the SERPs. If Google tuned sites with not the best content are in the top, they got many visitors from google BUT Adsense sees them leave as fast as they were come from there. This could very much improve the algo. :-)

adfree




msg:203716
 9:22 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

I still believe in Google's vision as their mission paradigm!

Any ad or other commercial motivation seems too far fetched for me.

And if there is one thing I can't believe in at all: manipulation or monopolization of SERPs by G, especially right in the middle of a VERY troubled IPO.

bobothecat




msg:203717
 9:40 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

>And if there is one thing I can't believe in at all: manipulation or monopolization of SERPs by G, especially right in the middle of a VERY troubled IPO.

I'm sure most of us would not have guessed Google would have done what they did to be in the middle this VERY troubled IPO ... wouldn't surprise me in the least. Adsense = profits, both for the publisher and Google. Profits are very important to Wall Street - perhaps it's just 'another ' coincidence.

PhraSEOlogy




msg:203718
 9:51 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

If a majority of sites that rise in the SERPs (as a result of this change) do not carry adsense ads - how does that improve googles revenue?

rickbender1940




msg:203719
 9:54 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

One thing to check: has the frequency of Googlebot visiting been affected during this time? Our results dropped the night of Aug 5. Simultaneously, Googlebot hasn't visited since then. This is on a site which got fully crawled once a day for the past few months (40'ish pages).

Anybody else seeing this trend on sites that have dropped?

PhraSEOlogy




msg:203720
 9:57 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

I have one site that is being hammered by googlebot every day and it lost 90% of its traffic on Saturday.

xcomm




msg:203721
 9:59 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

If a majority of sites that rise in the SERPs (as a result of this change) do not carry adsense ads - how does that improve googles revenue?

It is NOT about not carrying Adsense - it is about if carrying Adsense to perform good!

PhraSEOlogy




msg:203722
 10:06 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

xcomm,

It is NOT about not carrying Adsense - it is about if carrying Adsense to perform good!

I dont really understand the point you are making here - what do you mean by "perform good"? Are you talking about conversion from a click?

bobothecat




msg:203723
 10:14 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

>PhraSEOlogy
>
>If a majority of sites that rise in the SERPs (as a >result of this change) do not carry adsense ads - how >does that improve googles revenue?

Your guess is as good as mine... the above as you mentioned is not what I'm seeing (travel), nor what I've ever referred to. Perhaps things/results are different in varying industries.

xcomm




msg:203724
 11:06 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

Bobothecat you are right, so back to the main topic here.

The most important change at Google seems to have downgraded very big sites at 100000+. This seems what about this tread is.

shanbr




msg:203725
 11:07 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

The thing is, my sites have a topic for each page. Let's say that one is on a coke can. Everything is about a coke can, the shape, the height, what is in it, the metal that is used etc. all on one topic.

The title would say that is was a page for everything on coke can and so would the keywords, description etc.

The page was all about coke cans and not about odd items.

but they still dropped.

xcomm




msg:203726
 11:12 pm on Aug 8, 2004 (gmt 0)

The most important change at Google seems to have downgraded very big sites at 100000+. This seems what about this tread is.

Google seem think that some of this really big sites seem to delivery more quantity than quality, or?

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