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Back to Number One
How I got back to the top
BallochBD

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 8:29 am on Dec 22, 2003 (gmt 0)

Yesterday, after a few weeks of serious effort, I got back to the top of the listings for my keyword (a four letter acronym). How did I do it? Let's just say that stemming appeared to be important as was removal of unnecessary Header tags, reducing the instances of the keyword and careful study of the site that was already there. (In actual fact I am number three but the top two results are not relevant so they do not concern me.)

 

yvt360

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 10:58 pm on Dec 22, 2003 (gmt 0)

How many links do you have coming into your site?
just curious,

ogletree

WebmasterWorld Senior Member ogletree us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 11:00 pm on Dec 22, 2003 (gmt 0)

Or it could all be unrelated and it is just random that it came back. Or they changed the algo a little so that your old site untouched would have come back anyway.

danny

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 11:41 pm on Dec 22, 2003 (gmt 0)

I've just been relegated to #6, after being between 1 and 3 for five years or so (mine is an old site with very stable SERPS). I think the introduction of stemming is what's done me in.

LateNight

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 3:07 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

How far back did you come back from? Is there anyone who came back from oblivion. Has a pre- Florida page1 made it back to page1 after being sent to hell ie. 500 to 1000+ in the serps?

dazzlindonna

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 3:08 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

yes - pre-florida #1 to somewhere past 1000 during florida. returned to #2 yesterday.

Powdork

WebmasterWorld Senior Member powdork us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 3:21 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

My previous #1 comes back in at #10 when -in is the dc hit.

Easy_Coder

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 4:28 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

BallochBD -

I did the same careful review of the sites ahead of mine by compiling a matrix of data for gap analysis. After roughly 1 week my site made it from 250+ in the serps all the way up to 10. Previously I was in the top 5. However, the good results only lasted 1 week. Now, I'm back at 160-170.

Regarding my 2 word keyphrase, A couple of interesting trends I noticed while compiling my data...

The actual manufacturer of the product I sell comes up #1 everytime I search and stays #1 after every google update. Oddly enough the #2 result which has not changed since the florida update happens to be a premier google sponsor which if I'm not mistaken indicates that they're spending over 10K per month on AdWords. This leaves me feeling like Google is treating the premium sponsor differently.

Good luck keeping your top spot...

Easy_Coder

t2dman

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 5:17 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

Is there such a thing any more as a premier sponsor? People are now able to get the horizonal Google ads because they are the top of the adwords.

Would love to have some more analysis of how to get to the top - are text links allowed to include the search phrase? Or should they be say "key1 other key2".

hobbnet

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 6:25 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

By premier sponsor I believe he meant that they spent $10k/month and that's it...Not in regards to the ad placement itself. (the sponsored listings at the top are now just well performing adwords ads but they used to be sold on a CPM (or maybe flat fee?) basis.

I can confidently say that being a relatively big spender with google adwords DOES NOT affect your positioning in the normal/free Google SERPS. I recently worked for a company that was spending MANY times more than $10k/month and we were never offered any type of benefits except maybe 10 google towels and google lawn chairs. Google has always had a policy of being up front with their user base making advertisements obvious and seperate from their "real" content.

Giving high dollar advertisers some sort of preference would get back to the public incredibly fast and google would have a back lash they wouldn't want to and don't need to deal with. They are on top of the game as it is.

steveb

WebmasterWorld Senior Member steveb us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 7:08 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

Gonna be a lot of misguided webmasters the next couple weeks thinking some irreleavnt change they made lead to regaining rank in the serps.

yvt360

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 7:26 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

I did not do a single thing to our website and we came back to decent ranks from very low ranks. Pre-Florida we were 1-3 on the first page, immediate post FL, we were 200-400, post FL/Current we are close to top 10.
I have to believe it all comes down to quality content, if you honestly believe you are providing the best quality and quantity of content you will probably filter out back at the top. Although we do spend $$$ for adwords, I feel adwords are especially for those sites selling a related item to a search who don't want to bother with providing the high quality content, they want people to come to there site and buy. We don't sell anything on our website although we provide information on what it costs.
I did like the return of the directory, the new directory listings are very similar to the pre-florida listings without the spammy sites.

note: I just wanted to note we normally would have changed our website in some way during that time, we did not during this time due to all of the changes with Google, we wanted to be able to guage the events

Sorry if I am off my horse.

cabbie

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 8:38 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

>>>Is there anyone who came back from oblivion. Has a pre- Florida page1 made it back to page1 after being sent to hell ie. 500 to 1000+ in the serps?

I was surprised to see 1 of my sites come back from oblivion the other day.i gave up on it and actually took some pages off it to use somewhere else and crikey all of a sudden I am no#1 for more than some keywords. where before Florida it was never better than #4 or #5.

percentages

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 8:55 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

>Gonna be a lot of misguided webmasters the next couple weeks thinking some irreleavnt change they made lead to regaining rank in the serps.

Yup, until another full update where freshbot has no influence I have to conclude that the most of the sites "coming back" are possibly not for real.

I'm sticking with the "do nothing" plan until I can see what happens after the next major updating of backlinks, PR, deep crawl.

I see too many sites that took out many of their keywords, got crawled, put the keywords back in and now think they have solved the problem. If they did nothing they maybe just as well off.

Bobby

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 9:20 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

I'm sticking with the "do nothing" plan until I can see what happens after the next major updating of backlinks, PR, deep crawl

Heed Ye words of wisdom...the great Google in the sky giveth and taketh away

It would be wise to make only one change at a time and wait for an update to evaluate the effects of such a change. The more variables you throw into the stew the less information you get. And if google hasn't quite decided what its rules of engagement are how the hell are you gonna know if it's a change you've made or just google mixing up the cards?

I personally think google is trying to keep us guessing here, they sure don't want us to manipulate their search engine.

SlyOldDog

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 9:35 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

We made changes to a site and it came back a week after the massacre. Sice then we've changed it back to how it was pre-Florida and it has kept its positions leading us to believe the changes we made had no effect whatsoever.

Our sites are bouncing around all over the place and we are not changing anything.

Powdork

WebmasterWorld Senior Member powdork us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 9:40 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

I did nothing to return to the first page IMO. It's just a more realistic ranking system used by Google. I can handle a drop from 1 to somewhere between 10 and 15. Thats an algorithm change and we should expect that. A drop to 300 for a relevant site previously rewarded with a number 1 position is just adding insult to injury.

However. I have recently begun massive changes. I realized I've been poking around my region long enough taking pictures and learning that I too can create a mega site, and I can do it better. So this was really just a wake up call for me. Of course I have the luxury of a seasonal business, with the season having come to an end in October.
This should be fun.

SlyOldDog

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 10:06 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

A Mega site for Lake Tahoe Weddings right?

Google - you've got to do something! This trend to bigger sites is going to backfire big time. We can all create monster sites if that's what Google wants. But I am afraid the index will go from 3 billion pages to 300 billion, and there will be no new content there.

simonuk

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 10:49 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

But I am afraid the index will go from 3 billion pages to 300 billion

And that's just for weddings in lake Tahoe :)

Simon.

Crush

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 11:03 am on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

If you want a mega site. Do what we did, we built it in 18 languages

Easy_Coder

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 12:04 pm on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

t2dman

--> Is there such a thing any more as a premier sponsor? People are now able to get the horizonal Google ads because they are the top of the adwords.

On the page behind the "Advertise With Us" link located on the google home page there is mention of the premium sponsorship which indicates that if your a customer with a monthly budget in excess of 10K... google.com/ads/

Easy_Coder

vbjaeger

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 12:29 pm on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

How far back did you come back from? Is there anyone who came back from oblivion. Has a pre- Florida page1 made it back to page1 after being sent to hell ie. 500 to 1000+ in the serps?

Yes, from #4 pre-florida to nowhere post-florida, to #3.

Birdman

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 12:31 pm on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

Msg#3
Or it could all be unrelated and it is just random that it came back. Or they changed the algo a little so that your old site untouched would have come back anyway.

I must agree. I did absolutely nothing and just waited. About a week ago the site reappeared at the top, after being obliterated on all decent two-word searches.

steveb

WebmasterWorld Senior Member steveb us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 1:00 pm on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

The lost sites came back with fresh data. This is no big mystery, although some folks want to think in terms of oddball explanations instead of very mundane and expected ones. One update cycle and the quality sites that were "lost" should return to rankings in the ballpark they were before. The piffle/spam/actual-duplicate sites hopefully and probably won't.

superscript



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 1:07 pm on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

That's a very optimistic sounding comment Steveb. I sincerely hope it's true.

yonnermark

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 1:07 pm on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

One update cycle and the quality sites that were "lost" should return to rankings in the ballpark they were before

That's interesting. Are you sure? How do you know?

SlyOldDog

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 1:14 pm on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

Sounds like puff to me. Why would the sites need a fresh crawl? Many of these are pages which have been in the index for months pre-Florida.

Just Guessing

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 1:16 pm on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

In actual fact I am number three but the top two results are not relevant so they do not concern me.

I am number 88 for one of my search terms, but the top 87 results are not relevant so they do not concern me.

The strange thing is - I'm not getting much traffic ;)

superscript



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 1:17 pm on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

More optimism here [webmasterworld.com...] msg 58

Must be Christmas ;)

plasma

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 20763 posted 1:31 pm on Dec 23, 2003 (gmt 0)

Google - you've got to do something! This trend to bigger sites is going to backfire big time. We can all create monster sites if that's what Google wants. But I am afraid the index will go from 3 billion pages to 300 billion, and there will be no new content there.

100% agreed

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