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Will this be of some harm (excess keyword density)?
alaska keyphrase,Arizona keyphrase,California keyphrase ,...
AjiNIMC




msg:59456
 4:06 pm on Nov 30, 2003 (gmt 0)

Hi,

On around 40 of my pages, I have the following this on my right side,

Alabama keyphrase
Alaska keyphrase(link to corresponding page)
Arizona keyphrase(")
Arkansas keyphrase(")
California keyphrase (")
Canada keyphrase
(continues ,,,, around 40 such)

This is important to connect each page internally. Also the anchor text is important to get good ranking.

Will this harm for excess keyword density for keyphrase? All are links and linking to corresponding pages.

Thanks
Aji

 

Dave_Hawley




msg:59457
 3:29 am on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

Hi Aji

I don't *think* you will have any problems with keyword density. From my findings Google is not too worried by it. Don't get too caught up in the anchor text hype as it is not proven.

The ONLY SEO I do is;

1) Add content daily.

2) Design all pages for humans (don't get caught up in hype).

3) Include a site map to ensure Google finds all pages.

4) Put keywords in the Title, and Description tags but *ensure* it is easy to read for humans.

Dave

caveman




msg:59458
 4:34 am on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

hmmm.

I'll make up somethng I doubt anyone here is selling...

Alabama orange trees
Alaska orange trees
Arizona orange trees
Arkansas orange trees
46 more...eerrgh.

Maybe I'm too conservative, but sure looks like "orange tree spam" to me. Even if it's not a kw density problem - and it might be - this isn't very appealing to the user.

How about just a Header that says "Orange Trees by Region" (OK I'm not a copywriter) with the names of the states underneath?

Maybe I'm in the wrong business...

nippi




msg:59459
 7:06 am on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

I've specifically look at this and believe you are OK. I am in the same position, marketing a travel portal with activity keyword+ location etc linking the whole site togethor. As activity changes, activity keyword not repeated but location keyword is.

As far as I can see, then "penalty" applies to overoptimsation of keyword 1 and keyowrd 2 used togethor too much over a page.

It will never be possible to penalise for what you have done. A site that sells widget mats, widget covers, widget accessories etc would then be penalsied for widgets!

no. i say ok

caustic




msg:59460
 7:16 am on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

AjiNIMC - if it appears to be penalized, try a different way, or reduce the keyword density. To say there is no current penalty or filter is naive, considering the mutitude of seo professionals who have been hit by the latest update. I'm seeing PR7 homepages nowhere in the top 500 for the optimized term; last month first page. It hurts.

Nicola




msg:59461
 9:54 am on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

WHY then, are there still sites out there which rank top 5 on Google for keyword stuffing in a font color similar to background at the bottom of each page?

About 700 words repeated over and over. WHY is the algo not picking them out for this?

I'll tell you why, the current algo is not up to the job.

Powdork




msg:59462
 9:57 am on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

It will never be possible to penalise for what you have done. A site that sells widget mats, widget covers, widget accessories etc would then be penalsied for widgets!
Or maybe a site only about blue widgets only being penalised for blue widgets. Oh, wait, thats happening now. Nevermind.
AjiNIMC




msg:59463
 2:58 pm on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

Thats what Powdork, these days noone knows what to do. uncertainty is so powerful that predicting certainty has become uncertain.

What to do? Is the big question mark.

Maybe I'm too conservative, but sure looks like "orange tree spam" to me. Even if it's not a kw density problem - and it might be - this isn't very appealing to the user.

Caveman, I am doing this for the anchor text but from user point of view that might not be that appealing. At some point you need to compromise.

Aji

Dave35London




msg:59464
 3:13 pm on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

I'm seeing PR8 homepages nowhere in the top 500 for the optimized term

Bobby




msg:59465
 3:59 pm on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

I thought it might have something to do with keyword density but then I saw other sites using much more than me and they are still popping up in the SERPS.

I suspect it may have something to do with proximity rather than density.

Here's a question I'd like to put forth to those of us who have been "removed" from SERPS for a keyword or KW Phrase.

Does the keyword or KW Phrase exclude only your index page or ALL of your pages?

The reason I ask is because I used to have many pages appearing in the SERPS for my key phrase, but they are ALL gone now for THAT particular phrase.

I see many people posting on how their index pages are being excluded, but I am convinced it is a question of kw phrase being excluded. It just so happens that the index page is the one we use to focus on that search.

mquarles




msg:59466
 4:09 pm on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

Bobby,

Once your site is poisoned for a particular keyword combination, the poison appears to be site-wide, not page-specific.

However, as you well know, this does not mean you are poisoned on that page or elsewhere for other phrases. Just that phrase site-wide.

MQ

Bobby




msg:59467
 6:40 pm on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

Mquarles,

Yes, that's exactly what I've determined.
So now the question becomes "is my site poisoned because of the index page or because of a 'site-wide' over-optimization".

In order to make changes to rectify the situation we need to first know where those changes need to be applied.

Just to add fuel to the fire here, my site is nowhere to be found (where previously it held the number 2 spot) for my key phrase 'Blue Widgets in Italy'.
By adding 2 words - count them...TWO, my site reappears:
'blue widgets anyword in Italy anyotherword'.
The addition of a single word does NOT produce results.

Question: For those who have been excluded from SERPS can you add a word to your search query and get back to where you were before? Or do you need to add 2 words?

The reason I ask is because I am wondering if the exclusion is based on a keword percentage or rather the introduction of at least 2 new words in the search query.

If the words "blue", "widgets" and "italy" have been singled out as overly optimized (and the order is not important as far as I can tell) can I reduce the KW density in 1 of those words (like Italy for example) and get back into the ball game?

AjiNIMC




msg:59468
 7:04 pm on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

Yes, that's exactly what I've determined.
So now the question becomes "is my site poisoned because of the index page or because of a 'site-wide' over-optimization".

Yes bobby possible, have you ever appeared in an exam where it says,

0% -40 % --------Fail
40% -70% ------- Pass
70% -100% -------Fail

I appeared in such examaniation but now google is doing the same and all the SE0s are in 70% -100%. The philosophy has changed.

Aji

mquarles




msg:59469
 7:55 pm on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

Bobby,

I have one page that is even more extreme. It got dropped like a hot potato for KW1xx KW2 KW3s, which is an exact match with anchor text, but . . .

for KW1 KW2 KW3s it's #1 and
for KW1xx KW2 KW3 it's #1.

The xx is just an ending on the first keyword. All three combinations are used by searchers. The s makes the third KW plural. The xx is an ending on KW1 that most users use, but many do not.

MQ

Bobby




msg:59470
 8:36 pm on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

Mquarles,

That suggests that the words are viewed differently by Google, and would disprove the stemming theory.

It would be interesting to see if just the reverse happened:
a ban on KW1 producing results for a search of KW1xx or KW3 producing results for KW3s.

Have you compared the frequency of KW1 to KW1xx?
And KW3 to KW3s?

Sticky me your site and let me see what other ideas come to mind.
Unfortunately I only have this one site of mine to analize, that's why I'm looking for feedback from others.

AjiNIMC,

My gut feeling is that KW density AND proximity have a lot to do with the penalties. Perhaps when KW is in title tag and/or H1 as well as appearing in content at a very high density.

In my case ALL my titles begin with the phrase "blue widgets in Italy" as well as ALL the H1 tags.

Maybe we can get some more feedback from others and piece it together.

AjiNIMC




msg:59471
 9:12 pm on Dec 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

My gut feeling is that KW density AND proximity have a lot to do with the penalties. Perhaps when KW is in title tag and/or H1 as well as appearing in content at a very high density.

Bobby I was studing different sites after florida update, I have seen one common thing that is they are not over opitmized. What I mean is they have

link + title + 5%-10% (kw density, and yeah the proximity was there), no alt tag, no h1 tags. also the anchor text for links were not all same.

Things have changed a lot.
Aji

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