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This 680 message thread spans 23 pages: < < 680 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 [9] 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 ... 23 > >     
Update Florida - Nov 2003 Google Update
Looks like an Old Fashioned Dance Baby!

 2:29 pm on Nov 14, 2003 (gmt 0)

www-in is showing some major shifting in all the serps I follow.. anyone else seeing this? These results were showing yesterday as well, but synced with the others late in the afternoon.

The results look really good.. hopefully this will reflect across all the datacenters soon. Seems like the spammier sites I compete against have moved down while the good honest pages have moved up.



 7:44 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

i have noticed that index.shtml pages are gone.

is this a bug?


 7:46 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/index.shtml is still there


 7:46 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)


Could be something else dropping them then, in a few kw's I monitor they seem to have dissapeared. I guess then not in all, so it must be something else going on with those domains.


 7:49 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

"www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/index.shtml is still there "

damn, they why are our index.shtml are gone?


 7:52 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Does this dance mean that Google is back to regular Dances instead of the constant update?

I'm not convinced we ever actually achieved a *total* constant update, just very regularly freshly included pages, but PR and Backlinks (the major determining factors for competitive terms) were never constantly updated.

This looks like a good old fashioned update - still waiting in PR and Backward links to get factored in.

[edited by: subway at 7:53 pm (utc) on Nov. 15, 2003]

Tropical Island

 7:53 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Just checked a few of our main terms. One site has held exactly where it has been for the last year in #2 and another site has dropped a bit - from 12 to 16.

All in all I see no major panic.

Again, a great reason to have your AdWords program in place to protect your revenues when major changes occur.


 7:57 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Can anyone tell if the blogspammers and guestbookspammers are taking a hit?

I checked one keyword that was infested with bloggerspam links yesterday and it looks like they're wiped out. Still saw some guestbookspam links, though.

Just wondering what the experts on bloggerspam are seeing. Was about to throw my white hat into the trash and get a black one with all the success bloggerspammers and guestbookspammers are having. Maybe I should hold off.


 7:58 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

One thin I would like to add:

At 12/13 Nov googlebots hit us very hard.
The site is a shop and googlebot grabbed ~ 3000 + 7000 pages.
Traffic trippled on 14th! :)
The pages have been online but due to low PR didn't get crawled before.

At the same time a friend of mine had exactly the same ... effect.
He got ~ 5000 pages crawled that have been online long before.

I'd say Google updated PR internally already and crawled us deeper because of our new PR.


P.S.: location: germany


 8:03 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

I have to note that for the past several weeks I saw what I perceived to be an unusually high amount of click through tracking from their resultsets.

Normally Google will try it out once in a while, but it seems to be unusually common in the recent 2-8 weeks.


 8:03 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

>> damn, they why are our index.shtml are gone? <<

Not gone I'll bet... just gone for your main words and phrases. Do a search on other quoted phrases from within that page.

It's like the old missing index problem. Many index pages are down graded for terms and phrases you would expect them to appear on. In their place, inner pages of big sites (rather like the second Google problem of some months ago with repsect to Amazon, etc), which are generally less focused or relevant.

We've been here before:

a) Most webmasters recognizing there is something wrong
b) They complain repeatedly in volume
c) Google goes into denial
d) The odd webmaster whose sites have stayed firm or have benefitted claims the index is cleaner
e) GG seizes upon this as evidence that all is fine
f) The majority continue to point out problems. The vast majority notice good sites falling away for no apparent reason (at least in terms of quality reasons)
g) GG goes relatively quiet
h) Some in the outside world also start to notice something isn't right
i) The hum on this board continues but at lower volume
j) The word outside is still spreading

Eventually, at least previously:

k) Google eventually takes steps to address the exect problems which were spelt out on here on day 1.

I'd say that we are currently between c and e at this point.

I suppose k is a plus, because they have at least previously got there, albeit after a lengthy delay. The pity is though, that we keep having to head down this same path.


 8:07 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Ok - I had several of my sites dropped. They just don't show up in the top 1,000. However, when I search for allinanchor, allintitle, and allintext they show up in the top two or three. Anyone else noticing this for sites that were dropped?


 8:08 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Napoleon well said :)

I could not agree more.

None of my sites are spam and have plenty of content, but they have gone all over the place.

pages within the site are higher ranked then the index page.

Their are some very big issues with this update (not that it hasn't finished so we may be jumping the gun a bit)

Just sit tight and if nothing changes then shout a bit more.


 8:10 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Can anyone tell if the blogspammers and guestbookspammers are taking a hit?

Not from what I see.
My blogspamming competators are still running the show for my keywords.

However, I think the 15 minutes of fame is almost over for these guys.
When I check their backlinks in the blogs, most of the blog webmasters have removed the links!


 8:13 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)
guys, i search for our site like http://www.site.com/index.shtml - and there is nothing

i search for our site like http://www.site.com and its there

is this normal?


 8:20 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Vanishing here, on some phrases not all, mostly index page but also some internal pages. How can a site's index page be number 1 for a two-word phrase one day and completely gone the next?


 8:23 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Napoleon, I think your message #298 should be turned into a FAQ here. :) Then, each update, that FAQ should be the lead message in the new update thread.


 8:24 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)


A - K

Priceless and true. You have nailed it.



 8:31 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Some real stinky results. Tons of Ebay auction listings and bizrate stuff outranking quality pages.


 8:34 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

I was number 3 and 4 for a 2 word phrase. My index page was 3 and an internal page was 4. The index page is gone and the internal page is 13. They both had the same anchor text from other sites for the most part. The only difference is that the internal page does not have the keyword phrase linked to it from any of my sites. It is linked to from all the other pages but only from an image as part of the menu. The main page still ranks the same for 3 word phrases and that is pretty good. I don't see an index ban. Go through your logs and look up some minor terms and I bet you still rank where you used to. I think that Google has made an effort to make info sites rank well on keywords that should only return info sites. I still rank on terms that have to do with me specifically. Like keyword phrase profession I just fell out on the keyword phrase part by itself.


 8:36 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

GoogleGuy, said >I think this update should happen over a slightly shorter timeframe, so most data should be incorporated within 3-4 days I would guess.

Thanks for the information. Previously I advised not to panic, so I won't but I've decided be smart and call in sick for Monday & Tuesday. No sense going to that 10th floor office and risk facing a boss that is panicing.

If you think it is going to go longer, can you advise so I can get a doctor's note (required for more than 2 days absences)


 8:37 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

I already had the boss panic phone call. Not pleasent.


 8:42 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

ogletree said >> I already had the boss panic phone call. Not pleasent.

Advice. get caller id.


 8:42 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

I agree with Napoleon, but not about the bit where Google change their algo because people here moan and normal surfers notice a difference. It's these next 2-3 days that Google is left naked and exposed without PR and BL factored into the equation.

Q. Why are all the index pages missing
A. Because that's where 99% of backward links point to and the majority of primary and secondary keyword targeting occurs.

They are simply missing because they haven't yet been accounted for, but they will. Index pages are far to important to abolish altogether. What we are seeing now is red raw results without PR and BL's and it gives off the impression that the SERPS are missing huge amounts of info.


 8:43 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

I hope they go back to the continuous updates.
I sure don't miss these 500 post crying sessions.

We are changing our business model, so we make our
desired ROI on PPC listings. The free listings will
just be the gravy.


 8:46 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Google Guy
Just wanted to say thanks for the updates, info and such.

Perhaps you also have some insight into the PR problems as well.

I noticed they were gone for a few days, now they are back.

Does this mean they are corrected and PR flow is now correctly being calculated?


 8:48 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Crap I just noticed that my google directory PR has gone from number one with a PR6 to close to bottom with PR1. My toolbar is still PR6. My other site that was in the Google directory is gone altogether. It still shows a description but when you click on it I'm gone from the list.

PS this thread does not count toward posts anymore :)


 8:49 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

LGN1 - I guess you don't understand that money is made or lost with each update, and google is the number one search engine in the world. Anything less then crying and I would be disappointed.



 8:55 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

Too early to comment on everything, but looks like my site held its own or improved on virtually all things except for a few terms that aren't that important.

But, GG, have to ask - is this a sign we are going back to a monthly update cycle - with some fresh listings in between? Must admit, forgot how "entertaining" these google update threads were!



 9:03 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

I guess you don't understand that money is made or lost with each update

You should be designing your business model, so you make money regardless if you are in google or not. Sure it, nice to make more money when you are riding the top of the google wave, but I want to make sure im profitable with or without google. Diversification is the key.


 9:06 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

i love all the "you should diversify" proponents. whether you diversify or not - losing a top listing in google often does mean losing a lot of money. no matter how much money one makes from other avenues, losing a lot of money from lost google rankings is STILL losing a lot of money.


 9:06 pm on Nov 15, 2003 (gmt 0)

LGN1 - Do you hear me complaing? I lost my index page, but it won't make a blip in my earnings. I just want my users to find my home page when they type it in!


[edited by: johnnydequino at 9:06 pm (utc) on Nov. 15, 2003]

This 680 message thread spans 23 pages: < < 680 ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 [9] 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 ... 23 > >
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