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Removing a Redirected URL
Want to avoid duplicate content penalty.
tlhmh1




msg:128340
 4:02 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

I currently have the URL BlueWidget.com redirecting (301) to my main URL, BlueWidgets.com. Somehow, Google picked up BlueWidget.com and is now listing both BlueWidget.com and BlueWidgets.com in the top ten listings for the keyword phrase, "blue widgets." I cannot find any links in Google, AllTheWeb, or any other search engine pointing to BlueWidget.com, so I'm not sure how it got in the index. I own BlueWidget.com because of type in traffic. I AM NOT trying to spam.

According to Google:

"...if your old URLs redirect to your new site using HTTP 301 (permanent) redirects, our crawler will know to use the new URL. Changes made in this way will take 6-8 weeks to be reflected in Google."

I have had BlueWidget.com set up to do a 301 permanent redirect to BlueWidgets.com for over a year, so I'm not sure why BlueWidget.com is suddenly appearing in the Google. Also, since I'm using a 301 redirect, I cannot add a NOINDEX metatag to the page.

How can I remove BlueWidget.com from Google so I do not have 2 listings for the same website?

 

jcoronella




msg:128341
 5:06 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

This happens a lot with the Freshbot. I wouldn't worry about it... google will figure it out.

Explain to me again why you don't want two listings?

tlhmh1




msg:128342
 5:24 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

I do not want 2 listings because I do not want my site to be penalized for duplicate content.

Plus, I'm just an honest guy. :)

Seriously though, I hate seeing multiple listings for the same site in search engine listings, so for consistency sake, i shouldn't want to see my own either.

mcavic




msg:128343
 6:13 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

There isn't a duplicate content penalty. If Google realizes that one of the pages is a duplicate, it'll just hide it. And it'll eventually drop the redirected page - it might just take some time.

I agree about consistancy's sake. But for now, having two listings just means people are more likely to see it :)

tlhmh1




msg:128344
 6:27 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

>If Google realizes that one of the pages is a duplicate, it'll just hide it.

But how do I know that Google will drop the right one? I want to make sure my main URL is not dropped.

pageoneresults




msg:128345
 6:41 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

By making sure that your 301 is set up properly and the location of the new URI is correct.

Server Header Checker [searchengineworld.com]

I have had BlueWidget.com set up to do a 301 permanent redirect to BlueWidgets.com for over a year, so I'm not sure why BlueWidget.com is suddenly appearing in the Google.

I'll assume that you've made no host changes in the past 60-90 days and that nothing has changed with your current host and the 301 redirect.

nancyb




msg:128346
 7:03 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

sometimes I think ms. googlebot gets a little confused and, just to make sure she has it right, goes back to some earlier data. ;)

I changed hosts last October and about every month or two gogglebot still tries to Get my old shopping cart and gets a 404 every time.

I also have a lot of redirects because of structure changes (over a year ago) and googlebot is still trying to Get many of them - sometimes several times a month despite getting a 301 every time. I think the reason for these is due to some other engine(Ink)/site that still has the old link. Took the bot about two months to get all the redirects listed correctly, but she still keeps a checkin' the old ones.

mcavic




msg:128347
 7:10 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

But how do I know that Google will drop the right one? I want to make sure my main URL is not dropped.

In this case, it doesn't matter. No matter which one the user clicks on, they'll end up at the same url. But when it eventually figures out the redirect, it'll drop the correct one.

ciocan76




msg:128348
 7:11 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

Relax...you don't have a real problem here...

grnidone




msg:128349
 7:15 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

I do not want 2 listings because I do not want my site to be penalized for duplicate content.

Honestly, I wouldn't worry about it.

I have found Google not to be as strict on 'duplicate content' as they say they are. One site pointing to another is not a problem. You are obviously not duplicating content intentionally to put Google's listings in your favor.

The reason Google penalizes for 'duplicate content' is because they don't want people to try to list 50 urls with the same content.

Worry about other things like your consumer's usability of the site. The folks at Google are grown-ups: they can take care of their own site.

tlhmh1




msg:128350
 7:24 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

Hmmm....

I used the Server Header Checker linked above and discovered that my domain name registrar lied to me. They told me specifically that they were 301 permanent redirects, but the Server Header Checker says it is a 302 redirect.

Now what?

mcavic




msg:128351
 7:27 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

Aha! That makes a difference. I'd talk to the registrar. If they can't fix it, you can do the redirect yourself depending on what kind of server and hosting plan you have.

nancyb




msg:128352
 7:33 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

I would say you need to call them ASAP. Perhaps they misunderstood you ;) and thought it was a temporary change.

Also, I can't think of any reason why you couldn't use the meta NOINDEX on the old page with the 301. If it was a temporary change, you might not want to, but with the 301 the bots should go right on by to the new page the 301 directs them to so they would never see the NOINDEX unless the redirect was improperly set up - as has happend to you.

tlhmh1




msg:128353
 7:35 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

>Also, I can't think of any reason why you couldn't use the meta NOINDEX on the old page...

There is no old page. I simply purchased the domain name BlueWidget.com from GoDaddy and redirected it to BlueWidgets.com. Since my domain name is also a trademark, I didn't want someone buying BlueWidget.com trying to steal my traffic.

nancyb




msg:128354
 7:51 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

ah, that makes sense. I misunderstood :)

Marcia




msg:128355
 8:07 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

That's exactly the problem with domains that are parked at registrars and "pointed" to a site.

One site I work with was losing type-in traffic to another site with a very similar name - two words instead of three. The owner purchased the other domain name and "pointed it." I had specifically cautioned that it was OK as long as a 301 redirect was used. The web designer, not having a clue, "pointed" it, resulting in a 302.

The problem was that the other domain name had had a full site on it, with many inbound links, including an ODP listing. ALL the search engines messed up with it. The other domain - same theme, same target market, but totally different products, was kept by the engines and the correct domain got dropped. Obviously the rankings were all lost, since none of the titles and text coincided with the right keywords. I actually found it out accidentally when doing the regular hand checking so it was corrected.

It can have a very serious impact in some cases, since all traffic can be lost, with no one ever getting to the site. No rankings = no traffic = no income.

Not all search engines handle it as well as Google when it comes to correcting the error, either. On another site, Inktomi now has the OLD location of a site listed after a hosting change, in spite of a 301 for a year. Of course, the old location has no links pointing to it - they're all for the correct location, and rankings are around 15/16 instead of #1. That's caused a significant drop in sales.

It's very interesting because it shows us what the balance is between the weight of links vs. on page optimization, but it's not a good thing when it comes to earning income from a site.

tlhmh1




msg:128356
 8:17 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

That's scary, Marcia. That's why I am so concerned. As I mentioned above, I was specifically told that the redirects are 301 redirects, but when I used the Server Header Checker, I found out they were 302.

I have written GoDaddy demanding an explanation. We'll see what they say.

ogletree




msg:128357
 8:20 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

I had one site pointed to my main site until I got to it to add content. I then made it it's own site. It eventually got PR. The funny thing is that googlebot keeps spidering all the old pages. I get a ton of 404 errors from googlebot. Google will give the 301 site a PR0 eventually. You just got to wait. There is nothing you can do about it. You are doing nothing wrong.

pageoneresults




msg:128358
 9:19 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

I'm a firm believer that many of the registrars have their redirects set up incorrectly. I have advised all of my clients and prospects not to use the redirect options available from their registrars.

HTTP Status Codes

10.3.3 302 Found
The requested resource resides temporarily under a different URI. Since the redirection might be altered on occasion, the client SHOULD continue to use the Request-URI for future requests.

10.3.2 301 Moved Permanently
The requested resource has been assigned a new permanent URI and any future references to this resource SHOULD use one of the returned URIs.

Since I got burnt by an incorrectly redirected domain a couple years ago, I went on a mission to learn everything I could about HTTP Status Codes.

In theory, a 302 implementation on parked domains or any domain that should be permanently redirecting is not correct. I feel registrars and those who offer redirecting services should be using the 301 moved permanently.

If I were a registrar, I'd probably allow the user to select either option; 301 or 302. I can think of very few instances where a 302 is needed but, if it is needed, then the option should be available. The 301 would be the default option with an explanation why a 301 is recommended.

mcavic




msg:128359
 9:27 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

I feel registrars and those who offer redirecting services should be using the 301 moved permanently.

Yes, 301 should always be the default unless there's a specific reason why it's temporary, and I can't think of many instances that really are. Unfortunately, 302 is the default in many places.

A lot of people don't understand the difference because browsers treat them the same.

pageoneresults




msg:128360
 9:33 pm on Jul 17, 2003 (gmt 0)

A little OT (Off Topic). For those wondering why the abbreviation URI is being used instead of URL...

URI - Uniform Resource Identifier
The generic set of all names/addresses that are short strings that refer to resources.

URL - Uniform Resource Locator
An informal term (no longer used in technical specifications) associated with popular URI schemes: http, ftp, mailto, etc.

URL is now deprecated. ;)

alice




msg:128361
 12:48 am on Jul 18, 2003 (gmt 0)

I set up a website that was meant to complimentary to my main site, but not totally related. Well, I found myself needing to cross-link extensively and decided I didn't want to get in trouble, so I moved all the pages to my main site and decided to forward the 2nd domain to the main site as well.

Well, normally on domain forwarding, the domain only points to the page, right? My domain registrar has done something weird and the forwarded domain picks up the page it is pointing to, but keeps the forwarded domain name as it's URL. I didn't choose domain masking...just regular forwarding.

When I enter the forwarded domain, its Google PR still shows...not the PR of the site I have forwarded it to.

By doing this, don't I now have two duplicate pages? One with the forwarded domain name and the page that I created to forward to? Also, am I still not guilty of cross-linking because all the links on the page go to my main domain?

I hope this all makes sense...it was a little difficult to explain without names. :)

Alice

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