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This 104 message thread spans 4 pages: < < 104 ( 1 2 [3] 4 > >     
Main Index file gone
domain index file whiped out
paulk




msg:74946
 4:36 am on May 25, 2003 (gmt 0)

I have a problem... Out of 5 domain names, 3 of the 5 are missing domain.com/index.html file however other subfolders are listed in the index and seem to rank higher where the main domain.com index file isn't seen anywhere in google..... anyone else having this problem?

Paul

 

AthlonInside




msg:75006
 9:27 am on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

I am happy you have your own thinking. :) You should study the semi-penalty thread to see if you fit the case. Maybe for all the while, you are not really caught by it. How old is your site? Is you backlinks showing ...

Napoleon




msg:75007
 10:05 am on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

>> You should study the semi-penalty thread to see if you fit the case <<

I think everyone on WebmasterWorld has seen that by now. There's nothing there but speculation... like on here.

The problem is that some lesser experienced folk are being sent down the wrong ally... working their butts off removing H1 tags/etc in panic mode. That's ridiculous, as Heini points out over there, and unfair.

I think if you actually polled the 'old guard', who have been around the houses a few times, you would find that most agree with me: Let it ride for a while - the middle of a state of flux is NOT the time to draw firm conclusions and start redesigning or making major changes to your sites. This was also GoogleGuy's message at the outset by the way.

I offered several alternatives theories earlier, all of which are just as possible as the 'semi-penalty' theory.

I'd just suggest to those who are understandably worried to try to sit tight for a while. I know... it isn't easy... you want to be doing something to recover... but you could end up doing entirely the wrong thing.


shaadi




msg:75008
 10:18 am on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

Agree with you Napoleon There's nothing there but speculation, I guess GoogleGuy can post in some thoughts to rescue the lesser experienced folk ;-)

steveb




msg:75009
 10:29 am on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

The junior, newbie and inexperienced webmasters should focus on the actual situation here, which is: any site put on line after January 10th of this year is liable to be in a state of flux and be producing changeable or bizarre search results. Any site put on line after Febraury 15th is not actually in what has been called the "permanent index". Nothing that applies to older sites necessarily applies to these sites.

This can't be emphasized strongly enough. The foundation of the results we are seeing is based on the Internet as it stood around February 15th. Newer sites will be in a state of ongoing Everflux ( [webmasterworld.com...] ) until the update that Google Guy has said will take place a month from now (give or take two weeks). Your pages will likely disappear and reappear multiple times during that time.

Napoleon




msg:75010
 10:38 am on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

Add to that other variables, which will have changed even for sites a few months older than SteveB suggests (anchor text shifts, content shifts, etc etc) and the whole situation is fluid.

The static sites tend to be those that have been around for 12 months plus, and I guess even for those there will be the odd example of flux.

So again, it is worth re-emphasizing, don't beat yourself up at the present time and don't engage in recovery tasks which may ultimately prove to be a waste of time and potentially counterproductive.

Sometimes it's harder to sit on your hands and do nothing - but sometimes it's the right thing to do.

sudden




msg:75011
 11:09 am on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

Hi everybody,

I have the same problem, however, my index page is still in Google´s index - it just completely dissapeared from the search results for my main keywords.

And while checking the index page, I discovered something very odd - there are currently TWO VERSIONS of my index page indexed! I changed the page title a little some weeks ago. Now, when I search for "Keyword1 Keyword2" my index page is listed with the old titel, when I search for "Keyword1 Keyword3" the new titel is there!

So, maybe Napoleon´s advice is the best made in the last couple of weeks - just sit and wait.

seekanddestroy




msg:75012
 11:48 am on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

Let's face it guys (and girls), it's just a huge mess!

What annoys me is that with a position of great power comes great responsibility, and what they do at Googleplex affects quite literally millions of peoples lives, either because thousands rely on accurate fair searches for income, or just because they know that Google returns (should that be used to?!) the most relevant results.

I have a whole load of keyword phrases that recently began returning a bunch of interlinked domains - we are talking dozens and dozens of domains which fill up Googles returns and are totally unrelated to the search except for the first (which is crapsville anyway and only gets there due to the current 'problems' and spammy interlinking of domains.

In terms of speculation here that writing links with keyword focus can get you penalised - well I'll tell yeah - these results I have reported to Google fly in the face of that - dozens of sites using the keyword phrase on many many links on many many pages has Google so impressed it fills the first ten pages of its results up with it!

I'm just hoping that Google sorts itself out very quickly, yesterday would be good, last week better! I'm plain sick of this little 'experiment'.

AthlonInside




msg:75013
 12:27 pm on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

I give up! But I am still with my theory. :)

IITian




msg:75014
 1:15 pm on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

Mapolean
The problem is that some lesser experienced folk are being sent down the wrong ally... working their butts off removing H1 tags/etc in panic mode. That's ridiculous, as Heini points out over there, and unfair.

Same with "penalty" for links pages named links.html and some are changing them to resources.html. And one day, remor will spread that that name is bad too and finally we shall resort to naming files randomly like cFgdtPnes.html with anchor text vhwosyfjridslv since those couldn't be caught by Google. Users won't have a clue but who cares. ;)

seekanddestroy




msg:75015
 1:38 pm on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

Based on some current results my recommendations for other webmasters would be:

1. register black widgets the 5th, red widgets the 5th, green widgets the 5th etc (perhaps the 10th - there's a lot already registered and I heare they're running out of numbers) - dont skimp on this, do like a hundred or so at least.

2. put them on seperate IPs and interlink them all with keyword heavy links (as makes sense).

3. don't bother with inbound or outbound links, you have enough of your own now, linking with other sites just wastes time.

Expect all of your sites to appear one after the other for the three and four word phrase searches you target at the expense of sites with relevant content.

On these sites create an Amazon affiliate link to your new book 'How To Spam Google Successfully with no hiddens, redirects or third party links'.

You'll make a mint from your sites and your book sales too.

Or perhaps wait until Dominic is history, and spend your time on some content while Google get's itself back on it's feet after the current disaster is over.

Hagstrom




msg:75016
 1:38 pm on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

Mapolean
The problem is that some lesser experienced folk are being sent down the wrong ally... working their butts off removing H1 tags/etc in panic mode. That's ridiculous, as Heini points out over there, and unfair.

We're talking about removing one (1) H1 from one (1) page. That's hardly "working our butts off".

If and when Google fix their glitch, I might add one (1) H1 tag again. On the other hand I have done well so far without the H1 tag.

Anon27




msg:75017
 3:34 pm on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

Anon27:
Do you have a carbon copy for this also?

allintitle: keywords (index page not there)
allinurl:sitename.com (index page not there)
allinanchor:keywords (index there and ranking high)

btw, I am now seeing me return for some keywords in all datacenters except -fi, -va, -cw

unless the other datacenters are pointing to some weird place where I was showing before. But still in those datacenters, index page MIA for allintitle, and allinurl

allintitle: keywords = mysite.com at #18 when www.mysite.com was #2, but now is not found.

allinurl:sitename.com = index is there

allinanchor:keywords = index there and ranking very high

WebMistress




msg:75018
 10:45 pm on May 26, 2003 (gmt 0)

I am one of those folks whose index page disappeared, and have been laughing my fanny off about the semi-penalty theory and everyone rushing out to change their H1 tags, etc. So to prove my point that changing such things cannot make a difference in a matter of hours, I went ahead and changed mine. With the intention, of course of changing it back once I proved this wouldn't do a darn thing. Well, guess what. I changed my H1 tag, took out some kw density, etc. an hour ago, and I'll be darned if my homepage didn't just appear in www for one of my main keywords. Coinkydink? I think it is, but it's funny! Now when I see me return for all my keywords, I have every intention of putting my page back to what it was and seeing if I disappear. This is so weird. Google hasn't been at my site in the last hour, so what is this? some real-time test? If it is even really happening as you fix. I'm still gonna believe it's a coincidence. Will keep ya posted. It might just be a fluke I even showed up for a minute. But I have been checking data centers, and I haven't been at any of them for days for any of my keywords. I know this is gonna have people rushing out to change their pages. And I really hate to see that happen and backfire. But I just had to post about my experience just now.

batdesign




msg:75019
 12:19 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

I'm of the same opinion as you webmistress and that it's just a coincidence...but...it worked for. Of course I did this as part of a test on one page just to see if there was an over-optimisation filter thang going on.

The pages I'm seeing ranking highest are those with less focus on particular keywords, those with no keyword H1's, those with keywords spread more evenly through the page content.

Basically pages which have more than one topic, or keyword focus are placing higher than those pages which I previously had optimised for particular keywords.

This would make sense, kind of, apart from many high ranking sites are still doing well with over-optimised pages. I can only hope that google with filter these out, but I won't' hold my breath...spam is like cockroaches. There's always more of them, and they breed...

Anon27




msg:75020
 12:44 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

I can tell you that this theory does not work about H1, titles..., it is just that Google has not brought in links and/or other factors.

I know this to be true because someone stole my site: Content, graphics, metas..., everything. They threw in a few commas..., to make it different. The stolen site was picked up in the April crawl, with only one or two minor back links. (So even though my new content did not get picked up in the last update, stolen content did!) The stolen index page is in the top ten, while mine is lost... (was #2)

FYI, the stole site is now and has been for sometime a 404 page, due to my threats of legal action, but it does still appear in the top ten, along with all sub-pages.

So if this had anything to do with keywords in titles, H1, density..., the stolen site would not be there...

WebMistress




msg:75021
 1:49 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

I just changed my H1 titles back to H1, and I just came back for another keyword phrase. So, I certainly think the H1 changes were irrelevant, but just coincidentally happened at the same time I manipulated anything on my site.

Good news is I'm slowly but surely coming back for Keyword Phrases, one at a time. Anyone else coming back? Have faith you will if I did because I went dead for every keyword for my index page.

kaled




msg:75022
 2:21 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

Point of philosophy.

There's no point worrying about things over which you have no control.

Clearly Google is in a mess right now. It will be fixed when it's fixed and not a moment sooner. When it's all settled down, if necessary start worrying about how to claw your way back up to the #1 slot.

Personally, I wonder whether GoogleGuy should go into politics. He's forever promising jam tomorrow and a lot of people seem to believe him. Me - I'm a cynic and believe only what I see and here for myself, and I certainly take all things said by vested interests with a large pinch of salt, including GoogleGuy. I would not be surprised if things don't fully settle down for several months (and at current levels of panic that could account for several heart-attacks).

The one thing that is certain is Google is too powerful - it seems to account for around 75% of my traffic and I suspect that is the case for many other people. So what are we going to do about it?

Traveler




msg:75023
 2:32 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

Webmistress:

We are off/on on one of our kw combos, and have been all week.
Check the "dance" link- and use the "recheck " feature for your kws....you'll see different results 4 out of 10 times on some phrases.

Anon27




msg:75024
 2:46 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

Personally, I wonder whether GoogleGuy should go into politics. He's forever promising jam tomorrow and a lot of people seem to believe him. Me - I'm a cynic and believe only what I see and here for myself, and I certainly take all things said by vested interests with a large pinch of salt, including GoogleGuy.

GG heard my cries about 6 weeks ago about some spam practices. He took immediate notice and action. For that, he is a little bite more than jam on my plate. GoogleGuy is more like caviar.

Google is a mess right now, and GG puts out what he can. I suggest you learn to listen closely to what he has to say. I have. I do not always like what he has to say, but in time, it becomes fact.

BTW, Thanks GG.

[edited by: Anon27 at 2:48 am (utc) on May 27, 2003]

WebMistress




msg:75025
 2:48 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

Hi Traveler,

I was seeing the off on every other starting earlier today, and now on strong. But for days, I saw no off/on activity at all, I was just vanished. So, I do think the conclusion is that something is happening today, and it may be something positive for other lost sites to hold on to. If I'm coming back, so could others. OR maybe it's just activity between old and new SERPs on diff datacenter, but I've been keeping good track of what's happening on all data centers, and I think this is new. Will have to wait and see.

Anon27




msg:75026
 4:15 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebMistress:

I do not see any changes. Are your keywords unique?

Anon27




msg:75027
 4:27 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

GG,

GoogleGuy:

I just sent a a spam report with this in the subject:

"For: GoogleGuy on webmasterworld From: Anon27"

Thanks,

A27

sit2510




msg:75028
 5:07 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

WebMistress, I'm glad to hear that you got some positive signs although it's not final yet.

I began to believe that the lost of homepage is not an accident this time nor G technical problem. It seems to be a going-on, new algo of Google which is able to downgrade a certain page of their relevancy for your targeted keywords. In short, it is not necessary to be your homepage but your internal pages as well - once those pages fall in the same criteria. What we are seeing now is only one of the chapters of Google filter mechanism.

whatson




msg:75029
 8:37 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

I have noticed some sites index pages seem to have lost rankings, they have no PR, or PR0, but the rest of the pages in the site are all fine.
Why is this?

windows22




msg:75030
 9:17 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

My index page just got back for my main keywords after beeing a victim of the "semi penalty", hope it is there to stay.

What i did: Nothing!

kaled




msg:75031
 11:27 am on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

GG heard my cries about 6 weeks ago about some spam practices. He took immediate notice and action. For that, he is a little bite more than jam on my plate. GoogleGuy is more like caviar.

If you watch a man dancing in the desert long enough, eventually you will see it rain.

Maybe GG fixed a problem and may it was going to be fixed anyway. 6 week sounds mighty quick to me for any sort of policy change at Google.

WebMistress




msg:75032
 3:04 pm on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

Just checking in. I'm back out of the index for my main keywords. Unstable. Glad to see some of you coming back though. Let us know if it stays that ways. It will give us all hope.

Re: the playing with H1 tags. They are no longer there again, and yet, I didn't come back. I really think that semi-penalty theory is not the cause of our index pages missing. SOme of us made a change and saw a difference, but a lot of people also saw a difference and didn't do a thing.

Good luck to all.

batdesign




msg:75033
 4:15 pm on May 27, 2003 (gmt 0)

Same here. Main Pages disappeared again today and my 'terms and conditions' page is the only page ranking at all on my keywords! A completely non-relevant page...

I despair.

I am beginning to wonder about the adwords sales boost conspiracy theory...whether it was deliberate or not, google must be raking it in this month!

ulounge




msg:75034
 3:59 am on Jul 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

Just checked my index page is lost in limbo...

To me there seems to be a new index since not only is my index file missing but the sites that come up for my main keyword are all different than usual too.

Stefan




msg:75035
 4:09 am on Jul 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

You might find something useful in this thread:

[webmasterworld.com...]

Good luck

drewls




msg:75036
 4:10 am on Jul 1, 2003 (gmt 0)

I don't buy this 'semi penalty' thing either. It just doesn't sit right. If that was the case, and they wanted it this way, why all the bouncing back and forth? And why do some sites that rely heavily on anchor text stay in the index solidly and others don't?

It just doesn't make any sense for Google to enact a penalty like that. I really think that idea was thought up by someone who's a member of the 'save face for google at all costs' club that loves to hang out here.

If they were going to make a change like that, why do it as the same time as converting to a rolling update? If this 'semi penalty' is real, then why does it coincide with the 'freshening' of pages, but go back to normal when the fresh pages drop?

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