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the page is different in IE5 and IE6

 2:57 pm on Nov 7, 2003 (gmt 0)

My page is just a simple table with three rows. Each of them contains one embeded table. So that's three tables in one. The cells contain images, image backgrounds, some text and two flash animations. In IE6 it works great but my client has IE5 and sees total mess. Some cells are missing, the text is formatted in a different way, in a word the page is a mess.

Would You have idea what's wrong? I'll be very grateful for any clue.




 3:56 pm on Nov 7, 2003 (gmt 0)

Is your HTML clean and validated? if not, they may be responding differently to missing or wrongly-nested tags.

Do you have a full DOCTYPE at the beginning? If not, one may be rendering in quirks mode while the other is rendering in standards-compliant mode.

Much kudos for checking with more than one version of IE!


 6:25 pm on Nov 7, 2003 (gmt 0)

Use this: [validator.w3.org...] then report here back what you find.


 8:52 am on Nov 8, 2003 (gmt 0)

to Victor:

my doctype is: <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">

by the way, is that possible to have two versions of IE on one system?

I checked with the validator but it treated most of the usual html tags as erroneous, eg <b> mmmmmmm </b> had the other </b> wrong or it said that you can't use attribute 'height' with 'td' tag or 'topmargin' with 'body'.
There were no errors with meta tags though. It also said that the page is not transitional html.

Thanks for Your replies,


 12:18 pm on Nov 8, 2003 (gmt 0)

I found the bug! ;)

One of the cell contains a list of links which I formatted with the style in the head section:

P.sonda2 {
FONT-SIZE: 11px; COLOR: #000000; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana CE, Verdana; TEXT-ALIGN: left; margin-left: 10%}

looks like IE5 found such positioning confusing. IE6 was a bit more tolerant;) I changed '%' to 'px' and now it works fine. Thanks one again;)



 8:16 pm on Nov 8, 2003 (gmt 0)

might be a good idea to make sure the rest of your CSS validates. I just did and it was easy.

CSS Validator [jigsaw.w3.org]

It will solve many many interoperability problems for ya.

And yes you CAN have more than one version of IE on your browser. At the following address you can find ready-to-go folders, all you do is download the folder, save it on your hard drive, and just run the IEXPLORE.EXE contained within the folder, I had 3 IE versions running simultaneously on my machine, it was kinda cool. I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post this here, but if it gets removed, sticky me for the URL.



 10:41 pm on Nov 8, 2003 (gmt 0)

Use this !DOCTYPE instead:

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">

Go back and fix all of the errors. The margin and border errors are warning you about IE-only code that you can replace with CSS. The problem with the <b> tags is trying to tell you about nesting errors with nearby surrounding tags.


 12:16 pm on Nov 9, 2003 (gmt 0)

Thanks for the links (esp. for IE).
I'll check the css and report back.

As to the html validator I changed the doctype to 4.01. There are fewer bugs reported but still it says that it is not valid 4.01. Four errors are about the 'doctype' line:
'cannot generate system identifier for public text'
'reference to entity "HTML" for which no system identifier could be generated'
'DTD did not contain element declaration for document type name' and 'entity was defined here
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.1 Transitional//EN">' where the red arrow was under the first sign. The other errors were about lack of definition or using attributes that do not exist (height, width, language etc.)It even said that attribute like 'http-equiv' in meta tag does not exist. At the beginning of the report it says that it's SGML parser. Is it compatible with html?



 12:47 pm on Nov 9, 2003 (gmt 0)

>> At the beginning of the report it says that it's SGML parser. Is it compatible with html? <<

HTML is a subset of SGML.


>> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.1 Transitional//EN"> <<

It should be: <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">


 5:57 pm on Nov 9, 2003 (gmt 0)

I checked with the validator but it treated most of the usual html tags as erroneous, eg <b> mmmmmmm </b> had the other </b> wrong or it said that you can't use... 'topmargin' with 'body'.

Some of the html tags you're using are looking deprecated.

If you want pages to look more or less the same in different browsers, validation is really important... and it's better to get out of the habit of using deprecated tags sooner rather than later.

You're already using CSS to introduce styling into your document, so...

Rather than

<b>Bold words here</b>

you can try something like:

<strong>Bold words here</strong>

or, even better:

<span style="font-weight:bold;">Bold words here</span>

Instead of topmargin=0, you can use:

body {margin-top:0;}

inbetween your <style> </style> tags at the top of the page (or on an external stylesheet).

If this looks a bit different from what you're used to, don't be discouraged: you'll find a lot more help and a lot of people who are very competent at CSS styling in the CSS forum.


 7:08 pm on Nov 9, 2003 (gmt 0)

<b> is deprecated? I don't think so since I've never encountered validation problems with <b> before, even using a strict DOCTYPE. As someone pointed out earlier, it may be a nesting problem.

Ok, I went back and check and can't find either <b> or <i> on the HTML 4.01 list of deprecated elements.


 11:11 pm on Nov 9, 2003 (gmt 0)

Farix: You're right, they're not deprecated, I thought they were.

The W3C says this:

15.2 Fonts
The following HTML elements specify font information. Although they are not all deprecated, their use is discouraged in favor of style sheets.

15.2.1 Font style elements: the TT, I, B, BIG, SMALL, STRIKE, S, and U elements

[w3.org ]


 3:35 pm on Nov 11, 2003 (gmt 0)

I am just downloading another an older version of IE, hope two will work side by side;)

I've changed the doctype to html 4.01 but nothing has changed. Anyway, what matters to me is that the page works fine in all versions of IE although NN6.0 has problems with images in nested tables. There are some gaps and the images are somewhat distorted.

Looks like I have to develop the habit of using CSS where possible and validating the code.

Once again THANK YOU for your help.


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