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am i wasting my time with dmoz?
lights are on but nobody home
thehittmann




msg:478887
 1:06 pm on Jun 10, 2005 (gmt 0)

I've been submitting my site for about 12 months to the correct category of dmoz and getting nowhere. My site is clean and relevant and follows all of the dmoz rules and guidelines. I've had no response from the category editor what so ever. I thought about email the editor but there are warnings not to do that so I haven't. What on earth can I do to get listed in dmoz. The only reason I want the site listed is because of all the other sites around that use the dmoz content. Any info at all would be much appreciated.

 

cbpayne




msg:478888
 12:11 am on Jun 13, 2005 (gmt 0)

I've been submitting my site for about 12 months to the correct category of dmoz and getting nowhere.
You need to stop trying. You are putting your site at a disadvantage every time you try - you just overwrite the previous submission with the new submission date. If an editor sorts the pool of site by date, then you get putting yourself to the back.
My site is clean and relevant and follows all of the dmoz rules and guidelines.
I see that often from people who sites do not meet the gudielines.
I've had no response from the category editor what so ever.
You never will
I thought about email the editor but there are warnings not to do that so I haven't.
Editors are encourgaed not to respond.
What on earth can I do to get listed in dmoz.
You have done it. There is nothing more you can do, except improve your site - spend time on that rather than obsessing about DMOZ
The only reason I want the site listed is because of all the other sites around that use the dmoz content.
The only reason that DMOZ would list you is if your site adds value to the category - does yours?
flicker




msg:478889
 12:37 am on Jun 13, 2005 (gmt 0)

>I've been submitting my site for about 12 months
>to the correct category of dmoz and getting nowhere.

Yes, you're definitely wasting your time doing that! I am an ODP editor, and when I review submitted sites, I always review them by date. If you're resubmitting every few weeks, you may be constantly reshuffling yourself to the bottom of the pool. You're certainly not *expediting* your site's review by doing that (I don't know anyone who reviews the MOST recently submitted sites first), so it's probably a good idea for you to stop.

In general, I think spending a lot of time on an ODP submission is not a good use of time. Time well spent would be A) assessing your website and making sure it's the kind of website that's appropriate for the ODP before bothering with it (make sure the content is original, the same business doesn't already have a listing, and the purpose of the site isn't primarily advertising or affiliate sales); B) locating the correct category for the site; and C) submitting it with a concise, legible description (NOT just a huge string of words). Anything beyond that is probably a waste of time. Your description is almost certainly going to be rewritten anyway, so I wouldn't spend a lot of time on that, just make sure that it's readable. And once it's submitted, I wouldn't spend any time on it at all.

Two cents from my own personal piggybank. (-:

hutcheson




msg:478890
 3:04 am on Jun 13, 2005 (gmt 0)

>What on earth can I do to get listed in dmoz.

Nothing. There is nothing you can do to get listed in dmoz. "No site is guaranteed a listing." Says so right in the submittal policies. So ... that's the end of that.

We don't care why you'd want to get listed. Many people have ulterior motives for submitting sites. If it's a good site, we're happy for the help finding it.

But ... there are reasons why we'd want to list a site.

Well, one reason. Unique authoritative relevant content. "Who are you, and what happened to you?" "Who are you and what do you know?" "Who are you and what do you do for money?"

And there's basically one reason we go looking for sites on a particular subject: we think surfers won't find what they're looking for with the sites we already have listed, and we think more information might be somewhere out there.

So, the first thing that must happen is: an editor must decide to work on the category. This happens, on average, no more than once or twice a year per category. That's average, obviously some categories will wait longer.

And the second thing is, the editor must go to your site and quickly get the impression there might be something truly unique -- something you know that nobody else on the net can divulge -- some service you offer that nobody else can.

The third thing is, the editor has to poke around and actually find that information, those offered services, those recounted experiences -- whatever it is that makes you YOU, as opposed to a cigar-store wooden Indian.

Then it has to be classified and described. If you submitted to the right category, this bit is easy. If you didn't, the editor will move the submittal to a better category ... and now we return to step 1.

Once a site is PUBLISHED, all this can happen any time. Once you SUBMIT a site, we won't forget it until all this happens (or at least, all of it up until the point where we decide a site is a waste of time). And so that's all you can do, and all you need to do.

Beyond that, if you're thinking there's some way of coercing or manipulating or forcing or compelling or browbeating an editor into doing your bidding immediately ... you'll find the community will work together (effectively) to ensure your attempts are counterproductive.

kctipton




msg:478891
 5:39 am on Jun 13, 2005 (gmt 0)

"lights are on but nobody home" -- wasn't there a thread a year or two ago with the same subtitle? This deja vu thing is getting very unnerving.

victor




msg:478892
 6:09 am on Jun 13, 2005 (gmt 0)

I've been submitting my site for about 12 months to the correct category of dmoz

Sounds like you've been wasting everyone's time with DMOZ, not just your own.

g1smd




msg:478893
 4:12 pm on Jun 13, 2005 (gmt 0)

>> Am i wasting my time with dmoz? <<

Yes, after one submission to the ODP, any further submissions are wasting your time.

Additionally, if the multiple submissions were to different categories, or for different parts of your site, or for several related domains, then you may have also damaged your net reputation quite severely too.

Dynamoo




msg:478894
 10:22 pm on Jun 15, 2005 (gmt 0)

Yes, after one submission to the ODP, any further submissions are wasting your time.

Assuming the submission gets received. If you get any error messages at all, or even a timeout then come back another time and resubmit.

kupo808




msg:478895
 4:49 am on Jun 22, 2005 (gmt 0)

What would be a realistic time frame to getting accepted by dmoz, looking for a ballpark figure ie under 3 months or more?

hutcheson




msg:478896
 7:34 am on Jun 22, 2005 (gmt 0)

>What would be a realistic time frame to getting accepted by dmoz, looking for a ballpark figure ie under 3 months or more?

You've already left reality behind. There is no meaningful answer to such a question.

vigo




msg:478897
 8:41 am on Jun 22, 2005 (gmt 0)

thehittmann
Have you realized that you are in a ODP wasps nest here?
All the responses to that poor guy was so arrogant and selfish, shame on you "editors"

victor




msg:478898
 9:47 am on Jun 22, 2005 (gmt 0)

What would be a realistic time frame to getting accepted by dmoz

If the site is not eligible for a listing in DMOZ, then never. That's no different to any other website that offers non-recip links for sites that meet specific criteria.

If the site is eligible for a listing, then just as fast as the volunteer editors can get to it.

Very, very roughly, there are an estimated (and estimates vary widely) 5,000,000 sites today that are eligible but not listed.

Slightly less roughly, something like 2,000 new sites are added a day.

That leads to a raw average of about 3.5 years.

Raw, but meaningless. It's a bit like deciding whether you need an umbrella today based on the world's average rainfall:

  • Some categories - very many of the regional ones for example - add new sites within days of the editors becoming aware of them.
  • Other categories - including many commercial categories - are so much under attack from spam that new sites may be lost in the torrent. And the spam has driven away the editors. It needs effective action from industry trade associations to ban and penalise spammers before editors are likely to return in number. So the fastest way to get a listing in those areas may be to join, or start, in your industry's anti-spam initiatives.

    Analyze a year ot two's ODP RDF download files and you'll spot very many interesting "weather" patterns in the listings and delistings rate across many categories.

    True, historical data is only a guide for the future, but it's as close to a "realistic time frame" as possible. Let us know what you find.

  • kmick




    msg:478899
     12:48 pm on Jun 22, 2005 (gmt 0)

    thehittmann

    There is nothing more you can do except waiting. Just hope that one day, an editor come along and your site get reviewed and listed. It is a big mistake (because you are not editor and you will not understand how ‘difficult’ to add a ‘value’ site for the that category for the users) to ask how long your site will get listed, maybe some years later or until google not using DMOZ anymore or…., well, never.

    If you got an editor friend, please do ask him/her to review your site, then your site will be listed straight away (but I don’t think you have one, that’s why you post here). There is a better way though - became a DMOZ editor yourself, not only you can list your sites and all the sites of your friends in no time, but also you can refuse or delay all your competitors submitted sites, make them wait endlessly and miserably (maybe this is what happened to you, sorry dude) or even drop their listed sites, so, please try to become the editor of that category now.

    To encourage you to apply for the DMOZ editor job, DMOZ said that “Editing in the ODP can be a fun and gratifying experience”, however, there is more fun than you can think of for ODP editors, for example:

    Example 1, You can be proud of yourself, because you are doing ‘volunteer work for the internet community’ - DMOZ said this explicitly that editor may add their own sites and welcome people (include editors, of course), to join DMOZ to promote their websites, (sorry, I’m too thick here, doesn’t DMOZ said “we seek people (editors) who have a genuine interest in building a directory that is free of commercial interests and favoritism” too?). So you can just add sites that related to you and promote them as volunteer work, note that this is 100% legal, no one can say you are a wrong doer, how nice – you make money while enjoying fame for helping the community.

    Example 2, enjoying to speak to those people who are waiting their site(s) get listed and pretending to be a fairness nor bias editor to say something like;
    Example 2.1 “The only reason that DMOZ would list you is if your site adds value to the category” (while everyone knows that DMOZ listed many spammy sites, perhaps, spam site has something unique and value, you never know because you’re not editor, no matter what you say).
    Example 2.2 “Every editor follow their own rule to review which site first, therefore, not the longest waiting submitted site will get review first. This can explain why some sites get listed before the others.” (This is a wonderful reason to make your competitors wait forever, I love it :--) ) As such, I don’t see any problem to resubmit your site; except you are giving a ‘good reason’ out for editors to say that, you are delaying your site getting reviewed by your own action.
    Example 2.3 “You can’t see the difficulty to listing a site because you are sitting the other side of the wall, there are many other factors to decide which site is value added. Editor do more than just listing sites.” This really telling you nothing but it is useful for stopping the people who are waiting their site get listed and criticises about why they wait so long.
    Example 2.4 Final weapons, this will end and win all arguments plus it can make the receiving end feel bad or look like an idiot to challenge the way DMOZ run, “The ODP is no listing service” so don’t think DMOZ should list your site, or, “The ODP is a free service” so DMOZ has no obligation to review your site, final word, its you (the site submitter) wants us (ODP), we can live without you.

    Please add more example here as you wish, good day for you all.

    p.s. I believe there are some genuine good editors in the DMOZ follows the good old guidelines and try to make a quality directory, but the whole things is spoiled by some ‘bad seed’ within the DMOZ. Sad.

    So please, don’t waste your time here to ask questions like ‘how long will my site get listed’ or ‘Why other sites listed but not mine’ etc. Just like many other said before, submit it and forget it, just move on to make your website better and there are many other ways to promote your business.

    hutcheson




    msg:478900
     5:44 pm on Jun 22, 2005 (gmt 0)

    If the ODP helps you find sites containing information you are looking for, then you aren't wasting your time with it.

    If it seems to you more difficult to find information that way then some other way, or you are trying to use the ODP for something else, then you are wasting your time.

    If you want to help build the ODP, then the submittal policies and editor guidelines tell you how to start. I can't judge for you whether you think that would be wasting your time. It doesn't pay a salary or even commissions.

    But it is a fascinating and challenging community to work with. And it is a fascinating and challenging project to work on.

    It took a lot of hard work, by a lot of dedicated people, to build the Open Directory up to what it is today. My work was only a tiny part of that. But I can point to a few thousand sites I reviewed, enjoyed, and added; and a few tens of thousands of sites I reviewed and not-added (unproductive and frustrating, perhaps, but it relieved other editors of that odious task, and freed them to search for more thousands of good sites.

    It's easy enough to sneer at anyone because of the vast amount of work they haven't personally done; it's easy enough to call for enslaving anyone because they might use freedom as an excuse to do something evil. But, in YOUR real-world experience, what kind of people do that?

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