| 12:59 pm on May 8, 2003 (gmt 0)|
I believe that only Looksmart editors can submit nonpaid listings to those categories. If you cannot find another approprate category then you can post a thread in their forums or send a message to a Looksmart editor there.
| 4:57 pm on May 8, 2003 (gmt 0)|
Hi everyone, forum newbie here - I'm wondering is it very complicated to become a Zealot? Anything like the DMOZ process? I'm kinda thinking of giving it a try...got a couple topix I'm interested in (plus I collect dotcom swag and wouldn't mind nabbing one of those t-shirts).
| 6:06 pm on May 8, 2003 (gmt 0)|
I gave up with the zealot trip....
Passed the tests, then could not figure out how to get to work........
Guess that must have been the last test!
| 1:57 pm on May 9, 2003 (gmt 0)|
If I submit one of my pages to a non commercial category and I get accepted. Would all my pages get spidered by MSN .I'm aiming at getting my home page spidered which is optimized lets say for keyword "free classifieds". But since I'm in the irrelevant category would it make any difference if i'm trying to get any decent result for my "free classifieds" keyword as opposed if I was in the classifieds from the begining in the looksmart.
| 2:38 pm on May 9, 2003 (gmt 0)|
|Would all my pages get spidered by MSN. I'm aiming at getting my home page spidered which is optimized lets say for keyword "free classifieds". |
I don't believe the two are actually related. In other words, the directory is a separate entity from the search engine. (Someone correct me if I'm wrong!)
In order to be included in MSN, you could subscribe to Inktomi.
| 3:13 pm on May 9, 2003 (gmt 0)|
Inktomi , But that's for the secondary results MSN is pulling . I need to be in the first batch .
| 9:35 pm on May 9, 2003 (gmt 0)|
If you have one page accepted into the directory, info for that one page will be shown. There is no spidering. No information on any of your other pages will show in that "first batch" of results.
| 4:03 am on May 10, 2003 (gmt 0)|
Thanks for the answer but what happens if I get my page into looksmart and let's say it gets taken out for some reason but is already in the MSN. Does It need to remain all the time in the Zeal directory to be listed in MSN. Or would it be taken off during the next MSN update.
| 4:07 am on May 10, 2003 (gmt 0)|
Zeal is pretty confusing. The trick to getting in as a zealor is to use opera's multiple windows.
Then take the test, leave the results open in a window. Open a new window. Take the test again. Some of the questions repeat. Keep at it, eventually you will know all the answers or be able to look it up in an previous open window.
It took me 10 windows or so to be able to pass. Once I got in, I found out it was a waste of time because I couldn't understand how the dam thing worked anyways.
| 5:15 am on May 10, 2003 (gmt 0)|
I think you need a total of 75 points, about 10 sites submitted or so before you become a Zealot. I just submitted to one category and some Zealot idiot rejected it . He wrote that my site is commercial and it doesn't qualify, ,where in fact 90% of all the categories either sell something or sell services with one of them being yahoo, listed as a non paid . So I wonder if somehow I manage to get in with either this cat or any different and some other zelot moron decides to remove it , would MSN drop it or not .
| 6:06 am on May 10, 2003 (gmt 0)|
|The trick to getting in as a zealor is to use opera's multiple windows. |
I don't think you have to be an Opera user to cheat on the test this way. You do have to be self-delusional though :)
|I just submitted to one category and some Zealot idiot rejected it . He wrote that my site is commercial and it doesn't qualify... |
If your site is commercial it does not qualify (see the guidelines). I cannot see how applying this basic rule makes them an idiot.
|So I wonder if somehow I manage to get in with either this cat or any different and some other zelot moron decides to remove it.... |
If it is commercial it wont get in - end of story. Also over the years I have yet to find a Zealot who is a moron so the chances of you finding one are very remote in my opinion. If you managed to become a Zealot yourself however you may well come across the occasional moronic submitter but that is another story.
| 6:17 am on May 10, 2003 (gmt 0)|
With all the effort I did learn a lot about how zeal categorizes sites though ;)
The truth is, the whole zeal thing has a lot of potential, but I find dmoz easier to use as an end user.
| 6:20 am on May 10, 2003 (gmt 0)|
>>but I find dmoz easier to use as an end user.
I don't know how, 80% of the time I can't even get to DMOZ. Yeah, yeah, I know, non-profit, volunteers, etc. The volunteers have a rough row to hoe.
But no one can deny that fast loading pages get used, slow loading pages get ignored and citing lack of cash as a reason for sub-par service doesn't mean a damn thing to the average surfer.
| 6:38 am on May 10, 2003 (gmt 0)|
. Thanks georgeek, however I think there are much more interesting things to do in live than becoming a zealot, purely for volunteering purposes. And you’re absolutely right no Zealot can be an idiot, after all they all passed that exciting test. Zealot is a Zealot. By the way I very much agree with Clark, that directory is plain crap and I don't give a rats ass if it existed or not. I just wish my sweet little MSN was getting their result elsewhere.
| 5:09 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)|
<I gave up with the zealot trip....
Passed the tests, then could not figure out how to get to work........
Guess that must have been the last test! >
Yes that is the hard bit!
I recently had an online survey form from them, much emphasis was "ease of use" so I think they are aware of the problem.
They are very strict on commercial listings.
I have managed to get 4/5 sites listed, but always get a >site rejected response for any site that is in the slightest commercial.
To add a site, first log in, find the cat, click "add site profile"
Fill in the questions, then wait for the rejection -;
| 5:51 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)|
I got bored one day and passed those retarded tests. I submitted about 20 sites then dropped it. Sticky me if you have a site you want me to look at.
| 6:08 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)|
>>They are very strict on commercial listings.
Like dmoz it all depends on who approves the submissions.
A major competitor of ours spends much time submitting pages. Of the 60 or so most recent submissions only 2 were rejected for being commercial though all pages carry the same commercial content.
It's just the way it's going to be with these volunteer directories, almost impossible to get uniform standards and interpretations across the board.
The good point: By looking at this person's transaction history I know which editor's accept these submissions to which categories.
| 6:30 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)|
>>They are very strict on commercial listings
I didn't know DMOZ rejected commercial sites as a matter of policy?
Zeal do, or say they do.
Yes, depends on the editor...as always become an editor
| 6:58 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)|
Guess I wasn't too clear but my "like dmoz" was for the "all depends". At dmoz it "all depends" on what an editor considers an affiliate site or not.
| 7:50 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)|
The page I submitted to ZEAL does well in MSN. Other pages on the same personal site do OK at MSN as well. I have never submitted to Inktomi. So I don't know whether Ink crawled the site, the ZEAL submission led to more crawling by MSN, or what. But that's my experience, FWIW.
Regarding ease of use, I personally find Zeal a bit easier than DMOZ, as a zealot/editor. As an end-user, I don't see a lot of difference. Then again, I haven't edited long at DMOZ, so am just learning my way around there.
|Lawd Have Mercy|
| 9:45 pm on May 13, 2003 (gmt 0)|
Having experience at both Zeal and DMOZ, I found Zeal much easier to become an editor.
The way to get into both directories is to submit a nice juicy page of content. Here is an example: If you run a classified site then write an article on "How to Write Classified Ads". That type of material is excellent foder for both directories.
If you are already a Zealot, the LookSmart editor will give it a nod. If you are not a Zealot, it may take forever to get listed.
MSN uses Zeal as backfill. But if your page is presented correctly you can achieve great position and a lot of targeted traffic from the listing. I know my site does :)
Hope that helps.
| 10:53 pm on May 13, 2003 (gmt 0)|
Sorry if I sounded condescending that was not my intention.
As you know there are affiliates and AFFILIATES, zeal seems good at spotting the freebee commercial wanters, and can spot a hobbyist a mile off and let it be.
From what I have seen, zeal is a good resource for niche info, a site giving info regards passtimes hobeys etc with perhaps the odd affilate page to amazon etc will get in.
However, a full blown commercial site will have no chance for free.
This seems resonable and full marks to editors who do their job correctly.
Of couse corruption will always creep in, nothing can be done about this unless they made an across the board inclussion rate.
Which would put the vast majority of web users/site owners redundant.
As sickly as it may sound, I firmly believe everyone has the right to get info online for free so long as they do not profit from it.
Without people such as zeal this would not be possible.
Ok google as well.
| 10:07 am on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)|
I gave up on Zeal. I tried to be an editor (or a Zealot) but the directory was set up very weird IMO.
I don't see why anyone would use Zeal over DMOZ.
| 10:23 pm on May 14, 2003 (gmt 0)|
steve128, you weren't being condescending before, I didn't make myself as clear as I could have. But...
>>However, a full blown commercial site will have no chance for free.
As anything else on the Internet, it's difficult to make hard and fast statements. Zeal has a bunch of full-blown commercial sites. The two biggest players in a major online industry have had their main pages 'contributed by' zeal people -- one of them now an admin.
I ain't gritching, it's just a fact that with projects like these -- as laudable they might be -- there are always going to be major problems uniformly interpreting the rules and keeping a level playing field for everybody.
As for nothing being able to be done about bad listings creeping in, well, yeah, as long as it's on a volunteer basis it's almost impossible to stop. The old Yahoo paid editors was probably the best system, but then you have to charge to pay the editors and we get back on the old merry-go-round.
'Nuff said for now,
| 12:03 am on May 15, 2003 (gmt 0)|
Howdie Kurupt... funny dude...
lovin' DMOZ with that handle...
I've seen so much corrupt at dmoz it makes me spin...
Now.. about ZEAL... dunno about that... but me thinks that
since DMOOOZ will eventually be bought out by somebody some
how... and make it all proprietary... pay for play...
Then MSN et al LookieDatSmart are trying to make a play
for the "homie" "ain't" got a life... editors.... or the Pay the DMOZ
Editor Off scheme we all know and love...
7th inning stretch... yawwwwnnnnnnn.....
you know DMOZ is going to be replaced.... but when...
and by Google by how much...
Chalupee no ghaudalupee.. is on a diet...
lite lite lite lite big fattie....
| 5:53 am on May 20, 2003 (gmt 0)|
I submitted a web site to Zeal in 2000 - N-Sider.com - at it is not yet being published to Zeal's affiliates such as Looksmart. It appears that there are a rather large number of sites that are not being published.
I like Zeal's interface. However, I don't think that the quality of the database is as high as DMOZ.
| 9:23 am on May 20, 2003 (gmt 0)|
Clark and tbear, thanks amigos.
At least I wasn't alone with Zeal. I spent ages passing the tests and resorted to the several window trick too. And once I was in, all I did was try to change a few descriptions and then seemed to hit a brick wall. I'd be surprised if anyone can keep at it for long.
Of course, maybe I'm just dense.
However, I do think human-edited directories are a good thing. It's just that Zeal is very confusing. And don't start me on DMOZ
| 9:29 am on May 20, 2003 (gmt 0)|
I never had any problem with Zeal, but then I'm not trying to add commercial sites or sites into commercial categories.
The tests are pretty easy, even without the window trick. Just take them twice, the second time you should have figured out what they want, mostly because it just makes sense.
Don't think Zeal is confusing and never hit that brick wall.
| 4:33 am on May 23, 2003 (gmt 0)|
in order to your site to a paid category w/o paying, try this:
1) login to zeal
2) go to the category you like (it could be commercial)
on the upper right corner there will be a link to category forum. write a message there explaining who you are and what your site is about and ask an editor responsible for that category to add it there. you might have to wait for a while for that to happen (if it does)
or you can try to submit it yourself to a category that it does not quite match but is noncommercial. this way if it is approved, your site will come up during searches. it won't necessarily be in the most appropriate category but it will be "findable". beware, that you can loose points for submitting sites into wrong categories.
[edited by: NFFC at 11:43 pm (utc) on May 25, 2003]
[edit reason] No sigs please [/edit]
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