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Microsoft faces second WGA lawsuit
Windows Genuine Advantage
engine




msg:1569555
 2:37 pm on Jul 6, 2006 (gmt 0)

update Microsoft has been named in a second lawsuit over its antipiracy Windows Genuine Advantage program, which plaintiffs allege acts as "spyware" on their systems.

Engineered Process Controls, Univex and several other parties filed a class action lawsuit Friday in U.S. District Court in Seattle, alleging Microsoft installed "spyware" on their computers as a "critical security update." The suit comes days after another complaint containing similar allegations was filed in U.S. District Court in Los Angeles.

Microsoft faces second WGA lawsuit [news.com.com]

 

Web_speed




msg:1569556
 12:53 am on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

Microsoft WGA push into millions of systems around the world will have very serious ramifications and will reflect on the entire IT industry world wide.

This is their first step...a little annoying WGA nag message (saw it on a client machine today). Complete systems shut down unless you register/purchase/validate will probably be the next step.

It all start with Microsoft and ends with Microsoft. Makes you wounder where will the entire internet/IT world wide be if Microsoft suddenly decide to close their doors...

I wounder if Bill Gates resignation had anything to do with this...kind of "let me out" before you bring down 1/2 of the win systems around the world :)

Vishal




msg:1569557
 2:51 am on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

I wounder if Bill Gates resignation had anything to do with this...kind of "let me out" before you bring down 1/2 of the win systems around the world :)

Or maybe he was the reason that it didn't happened sooner? I think Bill was keeping MS in check, however after him, MS will get more aggressive, and lets hope it will be good for internet in general.

NickCoons




msg:1569558
 2:56 am on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

There's no way that Microsoft being more aggressive (in the ways that they already are aggressive) will be good for the internet.

With each step they take in this direction, they shoot themselves in the foot a little more. For another group of people, each of these steps is "the straw the breaks the camal's back"; and more and more will seek alternatives.

Vishal




msg:1569559
 3:47 am on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

With each step they take in this direction, they shoot themselves in the foot a little more. For another group of people, each of these steps is "the straw the breaks the camal's back"; and more and more will seek alternatives.

Suppose it goes that way, u mean to say that no good would come out of it on a long run?

mendeleev




msg:1569560
 5:29 am on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

It is counterproductive. Their real strength is derived from being a monopolist. For them, it is advantageous to have people (who cannot, or will not pay for software) using hacked versions, because it maintains their market share.

If they start pushing a sizeable portion of the market to finding alternatives, that will chip away at their monopolist position. When the WGA bug loaded onto my machine on 7 June - it caused me to research Linux for the first time in several years. I have not made the switch yet. But the WGA bug is a catalyst that pushed me to actually take some steps in that direction.

MS seems to be using the wrong equation to evaluate their situation. They are thinking, "millions of people are using hacked software, at a loss of billions to us..." I would propose a different calculus: "Our monopolist position is our entire competitive advantage - and it should be preserved at any expense."

Web_speed




msg:1569561
 6:01 am on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

Or maybe he was the reason that it didn't happened sooner? I think Bill was keeping MS in check, however after him, MS will get more aggressive...

Yes that's what i think too. The sound of reason has left the company....now what? the entire world (and i mean the entire world) is at the mercy of a bunch of over aggressive greedy, trigger happy MS development team...

Very sad really :(...very bad news for the entire IT industry WW.

With each step they take in this direction, they shoot themselves in the foot a little more. For another group of people, each of these steps is "the straw the breaks the camal's back"; and more and more will seek alternatives.

what alternatives...you mean stone age elaborate versions of dos like OP systems...:(

There is no IT industry and internet (as we know them today) without Microsft and the Windows Op system. No serious alternatives out there, IMO.

NickCoons




msg:1569562
 6:36 am on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

With each step they take in this direction, they shoot themselves in the foot a little more. For another group of people, each of these steps is "the straw the breaks the camal's back"; and more and more will seek alternatives.

Suppose it goes that way, u mean to say that no good would come out of it on a long run?

My mistake.. yes, it absolutely would be good in the long run. While I argue that their common practices are bad for them and for all Windows users, I obviously like seeing them lose market share because of their stupid decisions.

MS seems to be using the wrong equation to evaluate their situation. They are thinking, "millions of people are using hacked software, at a loss of billions to us..." I would propose a different calculus: "Our monopolist position is our entire competitive advantage - and it should be preserved at any expense."

Yeah, I always thought it was great when a software company claimed to lose X dollars because of hacked copies, because they assume that all of those pirates would have purchased the software otherwise.

what alternatives...you mean stone age elaborate versions of dos like OP systems...:(

I don't know why someone would want a DOS-like system; so no, that's not what I mean. I was referring specifically to Linux, which is in no way DOS-like.

There is no IT industry and internet (as we know them today) without Microsft and the Windows Op system.

That's very true.. most of the IT industry man-hours are spent identifying Microsoft bugs, fixing Microsoft bugs, and/or finding ways to workaround Microsoft bugs. The IT industry as we know it would move on to more productive tasks instead of trying to bandaid Microsoft products together and make things barely work.

I'm a long-time Linux user. I have one Windows box at home, because I have to, but avoid using it whenever possible. I'm a control-freak, and Linux gives me the ability to do whatever I want. For me, Windows being closed-source is enough to not use it. For others, that doesn't matter at all. Each time Microsoft does something that pushes the envelope that much further (Windows Activation, Windows Genuine Advantage, and I can only imagine what restrictions Vista will entail), another group of people will be put off by it and look to something else (yes, Linux in most cases).

I'll rant and rave about how moronic I think their decisions are, but secretly I'm happy whenever these decisions cause another person to say, "That's it, I've had enough of this, I'm trying something else!"

Web_speed




msg:1569563
 7:02 am on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

That's very true.. most of the IT industry man-hours are spent identifying Microsoft bugs, fixing Microsoft bugs, and/or finding ways to workaround Microsoft bugs. The IT industry as we know it would move on to more productive tasks instead of trying to bandaid Microsoft products together and make things barely work.

Naaaaa....that's an over statement and you know it. Windows is what made the internet work and tick, made the internet part of the mass’s everyday life and brought an explosion of software development and creativity to the world.

Off course it was buggy and still is....but it works, user friendly enough and most importantly, gets the job done.

Unfortunately, I don't see the mass fiddling around with the various versions of Linux, UNIX …not anytime soon anyway.

NickCoons




msg:1569564
 2:46 pm on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

Naaaaa....that's an over statement and you know it. Windows is what made the internet work and tick, made the internet part of the mass’s everyday life and brought an explosion of software development and creativity to the world.

I respectfully disagree with everything in that paragraph (including the part about the over statement) ;-).

The internet has historically been made of Unix and Linux servers, and it still is today. Microsoft has, and still does, play a small role in making the internet "tick," as there are a relatively low number of servers "running the internet" that use Windows.

I don't think Microsoft caused the big boom in the average user getting online. I think that happened in spite of Microsoft. Their only creativity lies with their marketing (and apparently in their ability to implement non-effective anti-piracy measures that aggravate honest people). The good ideas have always come from somewhere else.

Off course it was buggy and still is....but it works, user friendly enough and most importantly, gets the job done.

For a Microsoft network of any decent size, it requires someone babysitting it to make sure it continues to function properly. I can do anything with Linux that you can do with Windows (except encode a WMA file, but why would I want to?), so why wouldn't I choose the more stable route?

Unfortunately, I don't see the mass fiddling around with the various versions of Linux, UNIX …not anytime soon anyway.

People don't "mass fiddle" with Windows either. They use it because it comes on their system. In fact, someone could install Linux on a PC, give it to the average person, tell them it was the newest version of Windows, and they'd go along using it happily not knowing otherwise.

The number of users that get upset at Microsoft for the restrictive decisions will continue to grow, and they will look elsewhere. I don't know how many of those people there are, but it might not matter so much. Most of the rest of everyone will use whatever comes on their system. It's a good thing that mainstream manufacturers like Dell and HP are offering systems with Linux.

I'm sure it'll be only a year from now when you walk into a big-box store and see a system on the shelf running SuSE.

Web_speed




msg:1569565
 11:54 pm on Jul 7, 2006 (gmt 0)

I'm sure it'll be only a year from now when you walk into a big-box store and see a system on the shelf running SuSE.

One could only hope that you are right...and darn soon.

And you know what...now that we are talking about it, i may try a SuSE installation myself :)

wmuser




msg:1569566
 6:47 pm on Jul 8, 2006 (gmt 0)

I hope that there will be more lawsuits like that,i hope that thats a good way to MS selfmureder

vincevincevince




msg:1569567
 10:16 am on Jul 9, 2006 (gmt 0)

Good for Microsoft. Lose those who refuse to pay and gain a smaller but more loyal following, just like Apple have. I don't think this is spyware as it is part of Windows. You install software and hence you take the bad with the good.

Having used Linux for a few years (cygwin + kde initially, then dual boot, now single boot) I can honestly say that those who tout windows as the better OS are just fearful of the transition.

Think of someone who feels themselves 'good to advanced' in the use of Windows XP, ask yourself how long it took for them to get to that level. Did they install a brand new OS having never used a Microsoft product before and found they could do every thing they wanted easily within a day? Or did they adapt their knowledge of Microsoft systems gained from years of experience with windows 3.1, windows 95, 98, ME, 2000, etc..?

kaled




msg:1569568
 11:23 am on Jul 9, 2006 (gmt 0)

I don't think this is spyware as it is part of Windows. You install software and hence you take the bad with the good.

So, any program that you install intentionally is not spyware - that's an interesting point of view.

I would say that any program that calls home regularly, and transmits information is most definitely spyware (unless the user wishes that action to be taken, e.g. to transmit medical data from something like a pacemaker).

Kaled.

NickCoons




msg:3000625
 2:06 am on Jul 10, 2006 (gmt 0)

Think of someone who feels themselves 'good to advanced' in the use of Windows XP, ask yourself how long it took for them to get to that level. Did they install a brand new OS having never used a Microsoft product before and found they could do every thing they wanted easily within a day?

That's definitely a very good point. I have a friend that's a Windows tech, and I've been trying for quite some time to get him to dual-boot his system hoping that he'll eventually switch over. He used it for a day and for some reason became frustrated because he wasn't able to use it as proficiently as he does with Windows, which he's been using for years.

Once I exposed him to the error in his thinking, he realized that he'd better give it a bit more time before coming to a final conclusion.

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