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July 2001 update underway

 6:41 pm on Jul 19, 2001 (gmt 0)

Theeeeeey've started. I'm seeing several of my keywords that plummeted in the last update that are back up again - some on www, some on www2 and some on www3. Yipee, I hope I'm right and that the ones on www stay there!



 6:11 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

I noticed that www2 is finally displaying my pages that it crawled last month.

I've been waiting 8 months to get indexed on Google. I tried submitting my page to Google directly, joining their adwords program for a few days, etc. But the thing that finally got me indexed was signing someone's guestbook!


 6:18 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

for my site www2.google and www3 show updated results however with even more ranking lost.


 6:28 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

120 top 10...gone. (from here).

Holding breath: Hopefully, there are 120 replacements that will show up when referrals start coming in off the new db.
Only change to the format in the last two months? Added <META NAME="GOOGLEBOT" CONTENT="NOARCHIVE">

We'll wait 'n see...


 6:47 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

I lost some more, gained a few back on page 2 or 3 instead of page 1, but almost all of the sites above me have less link pop, either very heavy kw density -or- almost none and for one kw a japanese language site came up as #6.

Very strange and very disheartening! I've also been seeing a lot more 404 pages in the top ten lately although I haven't seen any so far for this update - but I've only looked a little.


 7:03 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

wooo....hoooo, www2 showing new results....I like it.. a lot :) hope ya all do well


 7:24 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

Wohho Hoo!
finally seeing a big change at www2.
Im at #1 - let the good times roll ;-)


 7:48 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

The interesting thing is that an old site which I haven't done anything with in over a year and resides on my old ISP (without even a domain name) is showing up in the top ten over and over. It hasn't even been in the top 10-30 serps in more than a year. It is also very similar to my "real" site in structure, text and content.

I was going to take it down, guess I'll have to keep it now but sure *won't* be doing anything to it since it is the only thing that may save my you know what again this month.


 8:01 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

there is a lot to be said for leaving pages up... you never know when that old algo may return and when it does...... bingo


 8:11 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

That was a righteous update!


 8:48 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

engine, basicaly my index page disappeared and only a site that links to my index page is there, realy weird, all my subdomins are there too just a little lighter in page count so far, maybe its too early to tell, but again some people are happy and some not, i wish i knew what google is targeting for the page search to drop from top ten to 2nd and third page...
also a quick question, would a site be spamming if they come up in a two word search very common one at that for every result three pages deep, the only thing that changed is the domain name.
these are not mine but the competitors.
just looking for some input.


 9:17 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

This July update as well as the ranking shifts from the 7th leave us with a lot of questionmarks. To start with: what about pagerank? what´s it worth if pages with high pr are buried?
Then: Do doorways return? It certainly looks as if pages whose sole pupose and merit is to point to pages with high pr are doing better than the pages pointed at.
ODP listings: are they worth the hassle? There are searches - not very competitive ones - where from the top20 two pages have ODP listings for the KW; one of those is say on #6 the other one on #18.

There is a lot of movement going on in google. For my main KW - medium competitive with nearly 2.000.000 pages -
the top30 shows significant differences. #1 has come up from second page.

We should really try to get a grip on this.


 9:23 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

>would a site be spamming if they come up in a two word search very common one at that for every result three pages deep

Take a very close look at those pages and the rest of the site, if you find anything dodgy you could elevate yourself by 30 positions in one go....


 9:26 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

It only takes small changes to change some things a bunch. Google does not even need to change the algo. Pages adding and dropping links could make all the difference.

I have some pages with very high PageRank (higher than every competitor out there in the ODP). Some do very well and some do poor. It almost seems as though the smaller pages with high PR do better, but that is just from my small sample.

I also seem to have noticed that my adult pages have gone down in ranking for targeted keywords (in general) while the reverse is true for my non adult pages. I had been spending most of time promoting adult in the last two months, so I was kind of suprised.


 9:53 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

Has anyone else noticed A LOT of pages using hidden text and ranking well this update? It seems like every other page I look at in the top 30 results for most keywords I am targetting are using hidden text. I've been noticing this little by little, but now it seems way out of hand, like hidden text is okay to use.

On a side note, whatever happened on July 7th is still effecting some of my sites now, in that pages that previously ranked in the top 5 or top 10 are now in the 20's and 30's. I still can't figure out why.


 10:04 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

Hidden text is very difficult for an engine to detect if done correctly.

I did notice one person using H1 text with CSS and the text was very small as well as hidden. There was like 100 key word phrases on a page of like 300 words.


 10:45 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

Perhaps I am a bit paranoid, but after looking at google's shifts since the last update and now this one, I'm beginning to wonder if there is something going on so illogical and un-statistical (word??) to prevent webmasters from doing page/site optimization.

What prompts me to wonder this is the number of 404's and 403'3 I've run across over the last month and the serps (last & current update) that are delivering a number of pages that have little to do with the given search term.

Also, it isn't just my site, but most of my competitors that also used to be on the top 1-3 pages have also dropped and been replaced with sites I haven't seen much of at all in the last 6 months -or- what appear to be almost new sites with little link popularity.

All by byitself this kind of shifting is natural, but when 50-75% of all the top ranking sites from the last 6-12 months fall significantly for my group of relatively competetive KWs .....


 11:00 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

Aside to Nancy - welcome to WmW!

I've also seen 404s, but the update hasn't reached what I check yet.

I haven't seen any changes yet, even the cached pages are the old ones that have been there for months.

Chris_R, I have been consistently seeing hidden text at Google, done different ways. The ones I've seen aren't even hard to detect.


 11:46 pm on Jul 22, 2001 (gmt 0)

Thanks, Marcia and Brett, too, for the welcome!

How did I ever miss this board?

I feel like singing that doo-dah-dee-doo-dah alien jingle. www2 is back to showing almost the same line up for one KW as it was all last month but - my cached page is new.

I think google is out to mess with our minds. I'm going to stop checking, at least, try to until later tonight. I love a good mystery, but ...


 12:14 am on Jul 23, 2001 (gmt 0)

Aside for Perfection,

Three of my major competitors are using hidden text HEAVILY and have been getting away with it for years. They beat my site (almost) every time on Google except for the few keywords where I am ranked #1 on DMOZ. It seems to work that way on many other engines that use DMOZ as well.

I don't know when (if ever) Google is going to do anything about it but I had a note from them a year ago saying that there was no existing rule against hidden text unless it was being abused. One of them has over 200 keywords hidden in his index page. If that isn't abuse ... I don't know what is. I am so confused ...


 7:30 am on Jul 23, 2001 (gmt 0)

Continued in Part two:


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