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Ink pay to list?
NFFC

WebmasterWorld Senior Member nffc us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 11:30 pm on Aug 2, 2000 (gmt 0)

guaranteed placement in the Inktomi search database.
[newsbytes.com]


 

dannysullivan

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 12:43 am on Aug 5, 2000 (gmt 0)

thanks, kamakaze!

> Could this have the perverse effect of making Ink *less* likely to spider other pages of the site or indeed follow the links from your home page?

I think it's really too early to predict. The key thing I'm going to be watching is whether this means that free submit to Inktomi suddently becomes more sluggish. It's going to be hard to charge for 48 hour turnaround on home page listing if you also do it for free via hotbot, canada.com, etc. That makes you think they'll either slow things down, which raises issues about freshness, fairness, or I think we'll see them instead decide to somehow do a greater depth of crawl for particular sites. they've got until september to roll out the program, and I think they'll be watching for the reaction of what people want, in order to figure out better what to offer (and how to price it).

redzone

WebmasterWorld Senior Member 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 4:04 am on Aug 5, 2000 (gmt 0)

Danny,

Good to see you over this way!!! I think the big key is that the "non SEO" types, are going to confuse the difference of a guaranteed inclusion in the index, with a guaranteed ranking, no matter what Inktomi posts about how a "paid for" URL will rank.

Us SEO types always start beating the drum against this type of submission service, as it raises our cost of doing business. It will be interesting to see how the rest of the world reacts (the masses), as Inktomi becomes the first actual SE, to charge for submission.

Though it's apples to oranges, AV did not fare well in their temporary switch to "bid for listings", Inktomi may meet up with the same type of negative PR.. Also, if Ink. still had Yahoo as a partner, they would be carrying a lot more clout into the paid submission route. Many may say, it's not worth it, because Inktomi only supplies secondary results to MSN/Hotbot/AOL.. IF Inktomi were the initial results for any of these major partners, it would be a whole different ball game... iWon has glutted their portal with other information sources as well, though Inktomi results still appear first, and foremost (for now).. :)

For us, SEO'ers, it's all going to come down to "is paid submission" the only avenue into the index... That's the $10,000 question in my mind.... Meanwhile, get everything into the permanent index that you can!!!!

NFFC

WebmasterWorld Senior Member nffc us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 9:01 pm on Aug 5, 2000 (gmt 0)

>Us SEO types always start beating the drum against this type of submission service

Maybe not in this case.

Imagine the seanario;

Good afternoon, Inktomi Search Support, how may I help you.

Help me, help me! Not only am I a shareholder [just buy one, it has the same effect] but I have *paid* you to spider my web site, but you won't you follow any links.

Well sir we only guarantee to spider your "home" page

Look sunshine, people who haven't paid are getting their links followed, what about ME!

I see your point Sir, I will make sure that all links from your home page are followed and indexed

Thank you.

BTW Sir how many links do you have on your home page

Errr.. 278,468

This could be fun:)

The Yellow Brand

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 10:40 pm on Aug 5, 2000 (gmt 0)

From Danny's article: "Inktomi's indexing system may drop pages if they don't appear to be satisfying search queries."

You aren't implying they are tracking user behavior, for example clickthroughs la Direct Hit style? It sure sounds like you are :)...

Brett_Tabke

WebmasterWorld Administrator brett_tabke us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 1:55 pm on Aug 7, 2000 (gmt 0)

Unless Ink comes up with some perk or garanteed placement, why would people pay just to be indexed with no hope of ever getting high rankings? Why would Hotbot continue to choose Ink over Fast, Google, or even Altavista?

I feel like there is another shoe that should be dropping on this story.

pete

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 12:31 pm on Aug 16, 2000 (gmt 0)

Always been keen on letting the free market dictate BUT...

I cannot believe that this pay for submission will be a long term play. For it to be worthwile, Ink. will have to aggressively differentiate between submitters who pay & those who dont, and that differentiator in time will have to be placement.

I suppose the alternative will be to put a time cap on the period that free submitters have to wait for inclusion in the DB and be exposed in results (say 3mths) and paid submitters get in within 48 hrs. But I still believe this will have to creep into preferred placement if it is going to succeed in attracting submitters to pay.

NFFC

WebmasterWorld Senior Member nffc us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 12:52 pm on Aug 16, 2000 (gmt 0)

>differentiator in time will have to be placement.

It seems that what Ink will be offering is a low priced product with a potentially high take up rate. I really can't see this effecting placement because of the numbers of competing domains, after all there is only room in the Top Ten for Ten sites.

What point would there be in offering a placement incentive to thousands of competing sites when the vast majority will be placed outside of the top ten. As customers of Ink we would then have a right to complain, which could be fun. :)

>a time cap on the period that free submitters

That could be what the last week has been about, a demo run?

Brett_Tabke

WebmasterWorld Administrator brett_tabke us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 12:59 pm on Sep 14, 2000 (gmt 0)

I just wish they would hurry up and release a statement about how this is all going to work. Talked to a guy yesterday that swears that the pay-for-spidering will have a positive effect on rankings. If so, what engines? With Ink way in the back seat on Hotbot, now second fiddle behind Direct Hit on iWon, and behind Goto on AOL. What's that leave for Ink?

Moraco

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 2:38 am on Feb 6, 2001 (gmt 0)

How do you that posted in this thread feel about the Inktomi pay plan now that it has been out for some time now?

I am reluctant to join in it, yet my rankings on the Inktomi sites have fallen for six months since. I thought it was because of the Yahoo switch to Gooogle.

makemetop



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 8:46 am on Feb 6, 2001 (gmt 0)

Having used the plan on a regular basis I am a strong advocate. The Inktomi algo is reasonably easy, I submit pages and they rank well, if they don't, I tweak and the results show within a couple of days with a nice flow of traffic. My clients think I'm some kind of Superstar and everyone is happy - Inktomi, clients, me and my Bank Manager! So I give it an A+!

yanton

10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 1:32 pm on Feb 8, 2001 (gmt 0)

makemetop

how would you (or anyone else) sum up the Ink algorithm?

Brett_Tabke

WebmasterWorld Administrator brett_tabke us a WebmasterWorld Top Contributor of All Time 10+ Year Member



 
Msg#: 1244 posted 1:35 pm on Feb 8, 2001 (gmt 0)

I'd sum it up in this order: Title, headings, density, word relations and proximity , bold, description, url, links, design, misc. (Is that seo cryptic enough? lol)

Anyway, back to the topic at hand:

I've used the program a touch (few dozen pages), and I can detect minor benefit in doing so. The real benefit is on new sites/pages for me and playing with the algo.

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