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Apple Co Founder Backs NSA Whistleblower
seoskunk




msg:4586984
 12:35 am on Jun 24, 2013 (gmt 0)

The Apple co-founder Steve Wozniak has backed NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden and admitted he feels "a little bit guilty" that new technologies had introduced new ways for governments to monitor people.

"I felt about Edward Snowden the same way I felt about Daniel Ellsberg, who changed my life, who taught me a lot," he said.


[guardian.co.uk...]

 

cabbie




msg:4587014
 4:49 am on Jun 24, 2013 (gmt 0)

He said he had been brought up to believe that "communist Russia was so bad because they followed their people, they snooped on them, they arrested them, they put them in secret prisons, they disappeared them these kinds of things were part of Russia. We are getting more and more like that."

martinibuster




msg:4587021
 5:31 am on Jun 24, 2013 (gmt 0)

He's a young man who is a high school drop out (GED). He doesn't have the intellectual or moral high ground to make the decision he made. Meanwhile he's running toward the Chinese for safe harbor while accusing the U.S. of being authoritarian? Typical impulsive Raskolnikov-type [google.com] thinking that occurs to early twenty something males.

zeus




msg:4587109
 12:42 pm on Jun 24, 2013 (gmt 0)

what the US is doing is pure SS style, not more to say about that. I thought it was the land of the free.

graeme_p




msg:4587130
 1:42 pm on Jun 24, 2013 (gmt 0)

He never said the Chinese were not authoritarian. He needs a safe harbour wherever he can find it.

Are you suggesting that only people with academic qualifications can make moral judgements?

What Wozniak says it quite true: the right to privacy has been abolished, and it does not matter whether another country is worse or not, it is wrong in itself either way.

martinibuster




msg:4587138
 2:27 pm on Jun 24, 2013 (gmt 0)

I agree with Woz 100% regarding the erosion of privacy and freedom. I have been on the same side of that argument since the Bush years.

I disagree with the choice of treating this kid as a hero. He is not a hero.

It's easy to pull a trigger, so to speak. Impulsive fools do it all the time. It's harder to work in the manner of real heroes like Ghandi and Martin Luther King to make actual change.

Trigger pullers like Snowden act without thinking through the consequences. For whatever reason, this kind of behavior is more common to young men his age than men or women of other ages. They act rashly and in black and white terms in a world with bountiful shades of color. The ranks of the jihadists, racist organizations, religious zealots, and even mass shooters are full of his kind. He is no hero. He doesn't even have the guts to face the consequences of his actions. He's a Travis Bickle type. [en.wikipedia.org]

graeme_p




msg:4587173
 4:28 pm on Jun 24, 2013 (gmt 0)

If there were no whistle-blowers we would not even know the extent of the erosion of privacy. Now people are aware of it change may happen.

I would say that he has the guts to face the consequences. He risks extradition, prison and worse. At the very least he face a life in exile and constantly under threat.

lucy24




msg:4587252
 8:11 pm on Jun 24, 2013 (gmt 0)

He's a young man who is a high school drop out (GED). He doesn't have the intellectual or moral high ground to make the decision he made.

Thank you for this useful information. I had no idea the Feds were in the habit of making classified material available to high-school dropouts with no moral compass. I can sleep better with this knowledge.

zeus




msg:4587258
 8:18 pm on Jun 24, 2013 (gmt 0)

I agree with graeme_p, some has to speak up, he has now started it, we could NEVER expect that from the politics.

phranque




msg:4587264
 8:42 pm on Jun 24, 2013 (gmt 0)

i didn't realize a formal post-secondary education was a prerequisite to intellect or morals.
not only that, he's 30 years old so he's hardly a "kid" any more.

it would be quite a stretch to assume he gave up a $122K/year job in hawaii to spend life on the run from the US government on an impulse, especially since he spent the past several years knowing intimately well how easily he could be tracked.

TypicalSurfer




msg:4587266
 8:48 pm on Jun 24, 2013 (gmt 0)

I'm glad he stepped up. Making a false comparison to Gandhi or MLK is foolish, I think the fake, corrupt main stream media rolled that one out as some type of anti stance they could take, "hey, he's not Gandhi so he's bad", doh! I can't believe thinking people even fell for that.

We've also found out that there is a secret judiciary behind the whole mess, a cloaked government with more power than the one we see. Thanks Edward for stepping up.

BeeDeeDubbleU




msg:4587382
 10:54 am on Jun 25, 2013 (gmt 0)

He's a Travis Bickle type.

He doesn't have the intellectual or moral high ground to make the decision he made.

So the USA either trusts Travis Bickle types with state secrets or they are incapable of knowing that they are Travis Bickles? That gives me cause for concern, as did the situation with Gary McKinnon. Despite what TV programs like "Homeland" tell us there seems to be an uncommonly large number of incompetents involved in US security. No?

[edited by: BeeDeeDubbleU at 11:16 am (utc) on Jun 25, 2013]

BeeDeeDubbleU




msg:4587385
 11:02 am on Jun 25, 2013 (gmt 0)

I disagree with the choice of treating this kid as a hero. He is not a hero.

He is also not a kid. ;)

brotherhood of LAN




msg:4587392
 11:07 am on Jun 25, 2013 (gmt 0)

I'm pretty sure he's privy to more information than us (US citizens or not) to reach an informed conclusion.

I'm still not sure how the whistleblowing is going to do anything for a 'greater good', but 'his sacrifice' is somewhat noble.

Staffa




msg:4587399
 11:35 am on Jun 25, 2013 (gmt 0)

He doesn't have the intellectual or moral high ground to make the decision he made

Lucky for us, mere mortals, since it's the (presumed) intellectuals with the (presumed) moral high ground who hang up the smoke and mirrors to hide their convoluted actions

martinibuster




msg:4587403
 11:50 am on Jun 25, 2013 (gmt 0)

I'm pretty sure he's privy to more information than us...


1. Snowden did not work for the NSA. He worked for Booz Allen Hamilton, a subcontractor of the NSA.

2. He only worked there for three months.

3. He was not a whistleblower, he joined Booz Allen Hamilton for the purpose of finding secrets and divulging them. He had his mind made up before he was even hired.

Here's a news report about it. [foxnews.com]

...he took the job as a systems administrator because it gave him access to the records he sought.

"My position with Booz Allen Hamilton granted me access to lists of machines all over the world the NSA hacked," Snowden said, according to the article. "That is why I accepted that position about three months ago."


Yes, the American government was spying. Is anyone really shocked about that? The Chinese are doing it, too, as are the Russians and the Israelis. Prior to the computer age we had spies planting listening devices in embassies and whatnot. To a certain extent this has always been going on.

I don't think it is right if the U.S. government scrapes large amount of data on citizens. The Obama administration should be more forthcoming about how that information is collected and used. I understand and share Snowden's concerns.

BeeDeeDubbleU




msg:4587404
 11:56 am on Jun 25, 2013 (gmt 0)

Yes, the American government was spying. Is anyone really shocked about that?
I am shocked that they are spying on me, here in the UK.
incrediBILL




msg:4587588
 10:17 pm on Jun 25, 2013 (gmt 0)

He's a young man who is a high school drop out (GED). He doesn't have the intellectual or moral high ground to make the decision he made.


That's pretty offensive dude.

I can rattle off a list of drop outs that are major players today as it has ZERO to do with his actions or whether or not he had the intellectual capacity to appreciate his actions.

i don't know if the guy is a Mensa member or a drooling idiot, but judging someone because they dropped out is just ridiculous as school participation doesn't make you smarter, it just fills you with government approved facts.

cabbie




msg:4587690
 5:54 am on Jun 26, 2013 (gmt 0)

He is a hero to me.
He has exposed the USA espousing the high moral ground for what it is.
Double standards.

zeus




msg:4587709
 7:26 am on Jun 26, 2013 (gmt 0)

martinibuster - foxnews, I hope you dont see that channel as news :)

It is not ok spying on people that are not under suspect, I hope in the us every single person is suing. This was really a kick in the gut that the US is heavily spying on there allies.

bhonda




msg:4587714
 7:34 am on Jun 26, 2013 (gmt 0)

Give it a few weeks, and all this will be forgotten.

No governments will be overthrown, nobody's going to prison (well, maybe a couple of scapegoats, but that's it), and nothing will change.

Is that right? I'm not commenting. But I suspect there is more going on here than meets the eye.

BeeDeeDubbleU




msg:4587716
 7:44 am on Jun 26, 2013 (gmt 0)

Looking at it from the outside and in the light of these revelations, John Kerry's comments to China were shocking. How can he possibly stand there in front of the world and try to claim the moral high ground? In these circumstances how can he try to blame China for letting Snowden slip through the net without blushing?

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