homepage Welcome to WebmasterWorld Guest from 54.234.147.84
register, free tools, login, search, subscribe, help, library, announcements, recent posts, open posts,
Subscribe to WebmasterWorld
Home / Forums Index / Local / Foo
Forum Library, Charter, Moderators: incrediBILL & lawman

Foo Forum

    
Apple Sued By Parents Over in-App Game Charges
engine




msg:4441528
 3:48 pm on Apr 16, 2012 (gmt 0)

Apple Sued By Parents Over in-App Game Charges [bbc.co.uk]
Apple is being sued by parents who claim the iPhone-maker is unfairly profiting from in-app payments in games aimed at children.

Many games on the iOS platform are free to download but offer game add-ons,...




The group said it was too easy for children to run up big bills without "authorisation of their parents".

Apple had called for the case to be dismissed, pointing out that in-app purchasing can now be disabled.


 

incrediBILL




msg:4441622
 7:30 pm on Apr 16, 2012 (gmt 0)

Yeah, let's sue Apple.

No personal responsibility.

Don't teach your kids how NOT to buy stuff in apps.

Don't disable your CC from being used.

Not to mention the fact that it wouldn't be a problem if they didn't use those iDevices as portable babysitters, oh WAH! it could cost you money.

Take away the gadgets and give the kids a paper BOOK, maybe some school work assignment, something educational.

You solve stupid problems by educating people, not with lawsuits like lame little cry babies because they need everyone to coddle them and their stupid spawn.

I.D.I.O.T.S. one and all.

...and people wonder why Moe slapped the crap out of Larry and Curly all the time.

martinibuster




msg:4441632
 7:50 pm on Apr 16, 2012 (gmt 0)

Marketing and selling to children is a touchy area. The parents may have had a point, but it has been addressed by Apple.

incrediBILL




msg:4441635
 8:06 pm on Apr 16, 2012 (gmt 0)

Marketing and selling to children is a touchy area.


If it's not covered in lead paint or has parts they can swallow, at some point personal responsibility has to apply.

That's the problem, nobody wants to actually teach the children.

That's why most of the children these days are turning into obnoxious little disrespectful idiots that don't have the combined intellect of a dim light bulb.

lexipixel




msg:4441887
 10:39 am on Apr 17, 2012 (gmt 0)

Don't disable your CC from being used.


I don't know much about how the in-app selling works, but I can tell you last month my 16 year old called me and said she was at Barnes & Noble and wanted to buy a Kindle for $175... She works, and it's her money, so although she didn't give me enough heads-up to do any useful research, I said, "ok".

She got the thing home -- after spending $340... That was to pay for the B&N membership they pushed on her, a $40 gift card to load into the thing so she could buy books, a case, a screen protector and the tax.

So, $175 turns into $340.

Now she tells me she "needs" my credit card to use it -- that it won't cost anything, but it requires a card. Sorry, I wasn't going to fall for that one.

I called the store and told them I didn't appreciate her (a minor) being upsold from $175 to $340, and I wasn't about hand her a credit card, especially where they had already sold her a B&N gift card to "preload" the machine to suck cash.

B&N advised she buy a prepaid Visa or MC to pass the credit card entry screen -- unfortunately, this is incorrect advice, as minors can't really purchase those cards without parental permission (technically and contractually, although many do).

So I carted up all the items, went to the store and asked for a refund.

Where in the H-E-DOUBLE-HOCKEY-STICKS do companies get the marketing nads to suck people into giving up their credit info, their personal info, and marrying themselves to a proprietary device that is GUARANTEED to keep you paying them.

Although she got a refund, the gift card "mysteriously had $23 dollars missing from it -- something the B&N manager could not account for -- the machine had "eaten it", but he wasn't sure where or how, and the online B&N card tracking system was too complicated for him to navigate by touch-tone phone.

We wrote off the $23 to experience, and stopped at the public library on the way home to take out a few books and DVDs.

We are handing our kids a commerce system where they will just plunk down a piece of plastic, never know what fees and charges are being placed against their accounts, and giving the corporate marketeers every bit of info they need to suck every last dollar they can electronically from their finances.

Well, not my kids.

incrediBILL




msg:4441888
 10:47 am on Apr 17, 2012 (gmt 0)

Barnes & Noble and wanted to buy a Kindle for $175


You lost me there as I'm pretty sure B&N sells Nook and Amazon sells Kindle ;)

However, it's a real shame you sent it back.

We have a Nook tablet and have been reading more books than we did in a long time, plus all the games and other fun stuff it does. Don't even know how they got it over $300 unless your sales taxes are insane because the Nook tablet only costs $250 and the new 8GB Nook is only $200 so I'm not sure what in the heck you had going on at your B&N, but the kid's being deprived of a really cool learning machine IMO.

The prepaid Visa is a great idea too, not sure why you're so against it, that's how I got my daughter into the wonderful world of debit/credit cards as she could only spend as much as she could afford.

It's perfect for not ending up with some massive bill at the end of the month AND there's no interest charged, it's cheaper, you never go into debt, and in the long run it's also safer than using a debit card tied to your checking account as those ATM/Debit cards I refuse to use.

What the heck, kid probably needs that cash for booze and drugs instead of technology that can help with studying via eBooks and not dragging around big heavy back breaking hard copy books, long term spinal damage, and don't forget the wholesale killing of innocent trees.

Sigh.

StoutFiles




msg:4441904
 11:51 am on Apr 17, 2012 (gmt 0)

Apple had called for the case to be dismissed, pointing out that in-app purchasing can now be disabled.


How do you disable it? Seriously, I didn't even know it was possible.

bhonda




msg:4441920
 12:21 pm on Apr 17, 2012 (gmt 0)

After reading the article, especially the bit about the kid who spent 1,500 in 2 hours, I can see why parents are upset. I guess it's that the parents are just not clued up enough about what their kids are doing with these things.

I'm not blaming them for that; it does seem a little unreasonable that a game (I assume targetted at kids) could cost that much.

But, suing Apple just isn't the way forward with this. Raise the complaint, fine. Make a lot of publicity noise about it so everyone's aware of the issue. Get the money back that your kid spent, like the parent did in the article. But don't try to get up on the deal by trying to win a lawsuit. That just cheapens the whole argument.

Rugles




msg:4441961
 1:48 pm on Apr 17, 2012 (gmt 0)

On my iPad I have to enter a password to make a purchase. Is that not the case with this app?

Or did the kids know the password?

Marshall




msg:4441975
 2:10 pm on Apr 17, 2012 (gmt 0)

I am some what anti-credit card. For those of you who remember the old credit card machines where they places your card and slid the top to emboss the receipt and carbons, I have often thought they should put your fingers in there instead to remind you that your are spending money. The only equivalent I can think of for today's devices is needles popping out of the screen/buttons to stab your fingers to remind you you're spending money. And the more you spend, the more it stabs. (The other option is have the device shut down for as many minutes as dollars you spend. Though a small electric shock might make the point too.)

The bottom line, especially for kids, with all these electronic payment methods, people don't "see" the money they are spending and have a real disconnect with it. And suing Apple is not the answer, education and discipline are. Just my humble opinion.

Marshall

engine




msg:4441991
 2:35 pm on Apr 17, 2012 (gmt 0)

You would have thought there was an App people could install that helped manage purchases. Something a parent would password so they had to authorize the payment.

mack




msg:4442015
 3:21 pm on Apr 17, 2012 (gmt 0)

[apple.com...]

Apple is the provider of the iTunes Service, which permits you to purchase or rent digital content ("iTunes Products") for end user use only under the terms and conditions set forth in this Agreement.

REQUIREMENTS FOR USE OF THE ITUNES SERVICE

This iTunes Service is available for individuals aged 13 years or older.


Kids shouldn't be on the app store or iTunes in the first place. Its lazy parenting!

Mack.

lexipixel




msg:4442057
 4:48 pm on Apr 17, 2012 (gmt 0)

B&N sells Nook and Amazon sells Kindle

-incrediBILL


Yes it was a "Nook", (not Kindle).

$199 - machine (see next line to find out "price" can be advertised as "$179")...

$ 25 - B&N membership to get 10% discount on machine (allows them to run "advertised price" for the machine of $179 in "marketing math")

$ 40 - gift card to load it

$ 30 - screen protector

$ 49 - case

6.25% tax (in MA you have to pay tax on the undiscounted price).


...but then again, they probably assume most people will just "put it on a credit card" and not realize how much they're spending --- the big "NOOK $179" poster in the store, in my opinion is deceptive since it requires you buy a membership card and all the extras --- which Marshal understands;


with all these electronic payment methods, people don't "see" the money they are spending and have a real disconnect with it

-marshal


That is one of my strongest complaints against weaning kids onto "plastic money". And worse, weaning them onto automated electronic payment based services that require personal and financial identifying information every time the device is turned on.


kid probably needs that cash for booze and drugs instead of technology that can help with studying via eBooks and not dragging around big heavy back breaking hard copy books, long term spinal damage, and don't forget the wholesale killing of innocent trees

-incrediBILL


FYI - she has:

(1) Desktop
(1) laptop
(1) smartphone

...doesn't drink or do drugs, is a voracious reader, and spends the majority of her leisure time in the lethargic type II diabetes inducing electronic world --- the last thing she needs is 4th device to "read" on. My suggestion to her is to migrate all "digital information consumption" to a generic tablet that isn't the marketing arm of B&N, Amazon, Apple or any other corporation -- and hopefully one which won't be spying on her 24/7.

...but thanks for your concern about >>> my <<< kid's drug and alcohol risks.

martinibuster




msg:4442075
 5:24 pm on Apr 17, 2012 (gmt 0)

You would have thought there was an App people could install that helped manage purchases.


One app to rule them all
one app to find them
One app to bring them all
and in the darkness bind them.

incrediBILL




msg:4442237
 1:53 am on Apr 18, 2012 (gmt 0)

FYI - she has:

(1) Desktop
(1) laptop
(1) smartphone


Wife and I got all those too.

Tablet's a whole different experience and the Nook tablet is a nice one in the price range for it's performance opposed to most of the other over and under priced generic junk out there.

FWIW, the laptops/netbooks have almost become orphans since we got the Nook, it's just so much lighter and easy to use.

Oh well, to each his/her own.

lexipixel




msg:4442249
 3:14 am on Apr 18, 2012 (gmt 0)

Wife and I got all those too.... Tablet's a whole different experience and the Nook tablet is a nice


I've been trying to research the Samsung Galaxy Tablet (the newer bigger models, not the 7), to replace the desktop, laptop and any need for Nook, Kindle or other vendor specific eBook Reader. There should be a law that new devices can only be released once every six months -- the current cycles leave you doing all your research just in time to make it all obsolete info.

incrediBILL




msg:4442261
 5:46 am on Apr 18, 2012 (gmt 0)

the current cycles leave you doing all your research just in time to make it all obsolete info.

Computers have been like that since I started in '78 - just more players now in a global economy makes it insane.

Dalaxy Tab is WAY overpriced IMO, if you're going that route, go iPad, but it doesn't replace a notebook/laptop, may come close, but no cigar, not quite yet, but it's close enough I rarely miss the others.

Anyway, bottom line is you'll still run into in-App game charges even on a Galaxy Tab as the current trend in some of the trendiest games, which caught my wife by surprise, is they now take TOKENS to play the games unless you're winning. Lost a couple of games and next thing you know you're spending actual cash buying tokens.

She went off like an air raid siren when she figured that out LOL

lexipixel




msg:4442548
 4:20 pm on Apr 18, 2012 (gmt 0)

It will probably end up like cable t.v... Remember when over-the-air was free, then the promise of cable was more channels, better content and no commercials.

Now cable costs $70-$100 month, everything is full of commercials, and people just accept it as a cost of watching t.v.

Pretty soon I expect everything (in the "app world") will be pay to play and full of "commercials" and up-charge features.

incrediBILL




msg:4442637
 7:58 pm on Apr 18, 2012 (gmt 0)

You're probably right but TV content, just like apps, cost money to develop
basically, someone has tool pay the bills to keep it all going

londrum




msg:4442638
 8:03 pm on Apr 18, 2012 (gmt 0)

which caught my wife by surprise, is they now take TOKENS to play the games unless you're winning. Lost a couple of games and next thing you know you're spending actual cash buying tokens

that doesnt sound much different to a slot machine. if you win on those, you can keep on playing, but as soon as you lose you have to feed it more coins

Global Options:
 top home search open messages active posts  
 

Home / Forums Index / Local / Foo
rss feed

All trademarks and copyrights held by respective owners. Member comments are owned by the poster.
Home ¦ Free Tools ¦ Terms of Service ¦ Privacy Policy ¦ Report Problem ¦ About ¦ Library ¦ Newsletter
WebmasterWorld is a Developer Shed Community owned by Jim Boykin.
© Webmaster World 1996-2014 all rights reserved